Sum 41 - All Killer, No Filler · Riffology: Iconic Rock Albums Podcast

Chris0:19 Riffology. We're back, mate. It's been about. Where are we?

Neil0:25 What do you. What do we do? What's your name? Where are we? What's going on?

Chris0:30 Chris Neil, Riffology. Classic albums. Over 25 years old. Riffology co. See you later. Sorry. There we go.

Neil0:38 We're done. We can go now. It's been a while since we did one of these. And what.

Chris0:44 What even happened?

Neil0:45 I don't know. Lots of weird stuff, wasn't it? I think I didn't know where. I had a holiday. You had a holiday?

Chris0:50 Yeah. But the thing is with holidays.

Neil0:52 Yeah.

Chris0:52 Is that no one goes at the same week.

Neil0:54 No.

Chris0:54 So you went for a bit.

Neil0:56 I went, then I went for it. Then you went for a bit and then. And then. I can't remember. Then you were tired and then it just went from there, didn't it? Know I'm in a new team at work and one of the girls in the team used to run one of our podcasts, but a big. A real one.

Chris1:11 Right.

Neil1:12 And it was funny. We were. I was chatting to her and we were chatting. She says, oh, you know, she's g. She knows. She knows the show and we were chatting about it and she, you know, she was saying, because they're not going to do it anymore. So she was like, you know, it's. It's funny to have something like that and be your baby and then not to do it.

Chris1:28 Yes.

Neil1:29 And anyway, we were chatting about it and she was saying that we normally have a break over the summer anyway.

Chris1:38 Yeah.

Neil1:38 And then she said, when do you have your break? I'm like, what do you mean, have a break?

Chris1:43 What?

Neil1:43 Like, she said, well, professional podcasts, proper podcasts, what you do is you do it in, like, section. So she said, you know, when you're plan, plan and you'll like this. She says, when, you know, when you're planning what you're gonna do for, like the next, you know, let's say your season, you're gonna do season, whatever, you're gonna plan what you're gonna cover. She said, I assume the albums and you're going to cover them. And she said, and then you might do like two of those and then you'd have a bit of a break. Let people catch up, you know, let them. Let them miss you a little bit.

Chris2:13 And that's what you're supposed to do.

Neil2:15 And then you come back. And I just nodded. I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, we do. Yeah, we do all of those things.

Chris2:20 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, clearly.

Neil2:22 Anyway, if we.

Chris2:23 If we planned anything, it would literally like, oh, no, I don't do that anymore.

Neil2:28 What our listeners will. Will really appreciate, I'm sure, is that we both got in the studio today and went. Whatever was it?

Chris2:34 Where did we go?

Neil2:34 We had to go back and re list got what we'd agreed. So while Chris faft, we did. Luckily we had blog. So it was all good.

Chris2:41 I think I did.

Neil2:41 I think I must have decided.

Chris2:43 Yeah. It was all done. It was all. Everything.

Neil2:45 I think I must have done it after we decided and then I'd forgotten.

Chris2:48 Yeah.

Neil2:49 Because I. From memory, I'd forgotten that we were going on holiday, like until, you know, when it's like. Are you getting that? Are you ready? Yeah.

Chris3:00 What's that mean?

Neil3:00 What do you mean?

Chris3:01 We're going on holiday.

Neil3:02 We got. We're going to Scotland. Right. Oh, I don't know. I'll get my shoes then. So a bit like that. So I think a bit, yeah.

Chris3:14 Did you have all that sorted?

Neil3:16 I'm quite good.

Chris3:16 I'm. Did you do that? Because I honestly, if, like, if it's like now we have to pack our bags to go away, I just go to pieces.

Neil3:22 I have. Look, I've got a long history of traveling at work, like.

Chris3:25 Of course. Yeah.

Neil3:26 So I am in this weird state, like the weekend, Saturday mornings for me. I literally just go and take all of the dirty washing wherever the washing happens to be. I literally. I got like. The boys have got like dirty washing, but I gotta grab it all. I quite a massive pile of it in the kitchen and I just run. I just do the. Do the whole lot.

Chris3:43 Yeah.

Neil3:44 And then I fold it and I put it all back into the wardrobes and stuff. And the reason I do it is because I don't like planning.

Chris3:49 Yeah.

Neil3:50 So it means that, let's say I've suddenly wake up on Monday and realize, oh, I've got to be in wherever.

Chris3:54 Yeah. You can just get.

Neil3:55 I can just open my case and throw like stuff in and I'm good. Yeah. But I've always done it.

Chris3:59 See, I don't like planning or preparation. So when it comes to holiday, like, I'm. I'm stood going, I don't even know

Neil4:09 what's going, what's happening.

Chris4:11 Well, and then. And then suddenly we're on holiday and there's a bag and the bag has got the things in it that.

Neil4:15 Your things.

Chris4:16 Yeah.

Neil4:16 That you need.

Chris4:17 Yeah.

Neil4:17 Gemma's dead. Good for you. That wouldn't happen if I. If I didn't do it. We wouldn't that wouldn't.

Chris4:22 It wouldn't. Just wouldn't work.

Neil4:23 It wouldn't happen.

Chris4:24 Yeah.

Neil4:24 You know, we wouldn't have a case. They'd be like. Lizzie would just get there and go, where are all the things? And then the kids would be like, I'm hungry. I've got no pants either. But in your week's holiday, we had it clips.

Chris4:40 Yes. Because we were on the cliff.

Neil4:42 Yeah.

Chris4:42 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil4:43 Good, wasn't it?

Chris4:44 And the man next to us.

Neil4:45 Yeah.

Chris4:45 Gave us the.

Neil4:46 The glasses.

Chris4:47 The eclipse glasses.

Neil4:48 My neighbor made some eclipse glasses out of old negatives. Film negatives.

Chris4:53 Yeah. Oh, and you could do that.

Neil4:55 Yeah, it was really funny. Like, his kids are gathered with these taped things over their face.

Chris5:01 Like, Jordy Lavor just.

Neil5:02 It did look really fun. But they worked great. And they. And I was like, does that work? And. Yeah, they were. They could. Better than the ones we had, I think.

Chris5:10 Yeah. I. I did the. The thing with a. It was like the man had, like, monocles. They were like one eye, you know, you kind of. What's that word? Wink. You wink. Close. You close one eye.

Neil5:23 Yeah.

Chris5:23 And then you put one over the other eye and then you can see the. See the thing.

Neil5:27 I. I explained to my children that you could see it through a colander.

Chris5:32 Yes. Yeah. We tried the color. Didn't work.

Neil5:34 Do you know what my children did? Well, they literally put the colander between them. Oh, I could just see a colander. It's just a colander.

Chris5:45 And now all I can see. Spots.

Neil5:46 Yeah. Jesus Christ. It just. What is going on anyway? This is a show about music.

Chris5:52 Driving home.

Neil5:53 Oh, yeah.

Chris5:54 To like, eight hours, nine hours in Cornwall. Yeah. But it was at night, and I thought if we go at. Well, Gemma said if we go at night.

Neil6:01 I did.

Chris6:02 No, no, no. She ever said, if you go at night, there'll be no cars. Which I thought, that's logical.

Neil6:06 Did that work?

Chris6:07 No, because they closed all the roads.

Neil6:09 Why did. Oh, is it Sunday? I used to hate that. I used to travel on Sundays for work. And they always used to close the. The railway station.

Chris6:16 Yeah.

Neil6:16 So I'll get to Tamworth and I'd go to London or wherever I was going.

Chris6:19 Yeah, yeah.

Neil6:20 And you. And I'd know as soon as you got there, you'd see the bus.

Chris6:23 Yeah.

Neil6:23 And you think, I better not be there.

Chris6:24 We go.

Neil6:25 Better not be that. Better not. And then you'd get in there and you go. And then. Then the man would come with his fluorescent tabard, and I'd say, oh, I'd like to announce that there's not going to be a train today. Everyone went a train station. They're going to be a replacement coach, like. And it'll be like, I don't know. Do you know what I mean? Like. Yeah, Botswana, whatever. You know what it's gonna take 12, you know, it would take like three hours. We'd always. It'd always be a replacement bus service from Tamworth to Milton Keynes or something.

Chris6:54 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil6:55 It's like stupid.

Chris6:57 Yeah.

Neil6:57 If I wanted a replacement coach service, booked one.

Chris7:01 Although I did a trip to London once because I originally booked the train. Yeah. I like trains.

Neil7:06 Yeah.

Chris7:06 Because trains you can get on. Yeah. And then you haven't got to worry until the man tells you where you've got to be.

Neil7:11 And you get tea as well.

Chris7:12 Yeah, yeah. It's all good. I'm dead into that. And. And on this. On this occasion, I think the trains were on strike.

Neil7:20 Oh.

Chris7:20 So we had to book a bus instead. I don't like that. And it was the National Express.

Neil7:24 Oh, yeah. There's a song about that and the.

Chris7:27 But I reckon the train was probably like, it's a London. So I reckon It'd be about 80 quid, 90 quid, something like that.

Neil7:32 Yeah.

Chris7:32 The bus was £20.

Neil7:34 Yeah, yeah.

Chris7:35 And I was like, this is the greatest thing ever.

Neil7:36 It takes like six hours or whatever.

Chris7:38 I got loads of stuff done and they got a us it.

Neil7:40 And you can't go to the toilet because they've got the chemical toilet and you.

Chris7:42 Oh, yeah, no, I didn't do any of that.

Neil7:44 I don't want to do that.

Chris7:45 Yeah, no, I did a wee at the beginning and at the end.

Neil7:48 That's not like you. You're normally like, I need a wee now.

Chris7:51 I was rocking halfway through.

Neil7:54 Do you know I. I went to a festival.

Chris7:57 Yeah.

Neil7:57 Was it last weekend or weekend.

Chris7:59 Oh, the vegan camp.

Neil8:00 Yeah, that was. It was really fun. There was some really cool. Really cool bands.

Chris8:04 Yeah.

Neil8:04 Tally spear.

Chris8:05 Yes. You sent about it.

Neil8:06 If anyone's. If anyone likes hard rock music. Stop. Just stop the show. It's boring. Go and go and find Tally Spear on. On the Internet. So she did good.

Chris8:15 Yeah.

Neil8:17 I forgot what I was. Oh, they had. When we got there, they were like just setting up.

Chris8:25 Yeah.

Neil8:26 And they put, you know, the. I'm going to describe it. You'll know exactly what I mean. You know the urinals.

Chris8:32 Yeah.

Neil8:32 That are like all together in the middle and you all like stand facing.

Chris8:36 They're the most awkward thing because you do. You lock Eyes. Do you not lock eyes?

Neil8:40 But normally. Normally there's like a little thing around them.

Chris8:43 Yes.

Neil8:43 Do you know what I mean?

Chris8:44 Yeah.

Neil8:44 So there's like a little bit of. Yeah, but you were all boys. All like, you know.

Chris8:48 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil8:48 Staring into. While you're urinating, you're looking at each

Chris8:50 singing to each other and then.

Neil8:53 But this one, I think they were being transported. I think they were not quite so

Chris8:57 they've been what, while people were weighing on them?

Neil8:59 They would be. They'd been like craned in and they just hadn't been put in their resting look and not put in their final location.

Chris9:04 Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah.

Neil9:05 So. So there was like an area where there were going to be toilets and

Chris9:08 that final urinal destination.

Neil9:10 Final urinal destination. Yeah. What a good movie is that?

Chris9:15 And then. And then.

Neil9:16 So, so you. You've got like the row of urinals and then you'd got like these that have just been like dumped basically next to them in the forest.

Chris9:23 Yeah, yeah, right.

Neil9:25 But they weren't ready.

Chris9:27 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil9:28 And people just started using them and it was the weirdest thing. Like just imagine just standing there and like just. Just flopping your thing and just doing it. And as like families are just walking past. The weirdest thing was like people would just go anywhere, weren't they?

Chris9:43 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But, well, they felt that it was the final. Your own destination, the final urinal destiny.

Neil9:49 God, that's got. I feel like that should be a T shirt already. That should be a T shirt. Do you know no one knows what album we're covering?

Chris9:58 No. Do we know?

Neil9:59 We know we are doing some 41 all killer, no filler. I had this on compact disc.

Chris10:05 I didn't. I didn't.

Neil10:07 In my car. This would have been one I had in my car and it would have been one of the going out. So. Yes, you know.

Chris10:12 Okay.

Neil10:13 We used to go out on Thursday nights.

Chris10:15 Yeah.

Neil10:15 In Burton or in Tamworth or in Thursday. Leicester. Yeah, Dirty Thursday. We used to go in Leicester.

Chris10:19 Yeah. Where'd you go in Leicester?

Neil10:23 In the middle.

Chris10:23 Is that what it's called?

Neil10:24 Just in the middle. I can't remember. Be drunk by the time we got there.

Chris10:30 Tamworth.

Neil10:30 Yeah.

Chris10:31 Well, the jailhouse.

Neil10:33 Yeah, jailhouse.

Chris10:34 The jailhouse had topless barmaids in the day.

Neil10:36 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris10:38 I remember that.

Neil10:38 We used to go to like. It was. My friend Daz lived in Tamworth.

Chris10:42 Yeah.

Neil10:44 I was kind of here in Burton. And then.

Chris10:47 Where have all the dazz gone?

Neil10:49 I don't know. What's called Daz anymore?

Chris10:50 No, I don't know anyone who goes by the name of Daz. Not even Darren.

Neil10:55 No.

Chris10:56 Maybe they have. Maybe they're dying out.

Neil10:58 Well, gone. Aliens. I think it's aliens.

Chris11:01 The Darren. The Darren Rapture.

Neil11:04 Discover. Taken. They've taken them all, one after the other, slowly, like. Just gonna remove all of the dazzers from. From planet Earth. It'd be a planet Daz.

Chris11:15 Maybe. Maybe it's all of them. Just the as is with the different vowels on the front. Not vowels, consonants. Oh, God.

Neil11:21 Anyway, then. And then another. Another lady lived in Leicester. And then it was their responsibility when the. When the boys came over to. To. To mine when they stayed at my house. Like we get a taxi from my house into Burton or in. You know, in. Wherever we were going. We'd sometimes go to the Traveler's Rest.

Chris11:38 Oh, mate. Travsing.

Neil11:39 Sometimes Griffin Dam, Travelers Rest. Sometimes we go into Burton and. But it's my responsibility when they come to my house. It's my responsibility to take them where to go. So neither of them would have had a clue where we were going.

Chris11:49 Yeah.

Neil11:50 That would be like, oh, I'll. I got this.

Chris11:52 Yeah.

Neil11:53 You know.

Chris11:53 Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then.

Neil11:54 And then, same thing. When we went to Tamworth, like that Daz would do. He's dead now. He's got. The aliens have got him. But this would have been one for me. This would have been one of them.

Chris12:04 Like when.

Neil12:04 When we came back from work or if we were going, you know, we were picking people up on the way out. This would have proper been on the. You know, banging on the stereo to have a.

Chris12:14 Why did everyone go to the Traveler's Rest? Because that was. That was like. Everyone went there, didn't they?

Neil12:19 It's awful.

Chris12:19 Yeah, yeah.

Neil12:20 There's another one up the road. What was the other one? There was another one. There was Travelers Rest and there was another one. Yeah, it's around the corner. And we used to go. Sometimes we go to one, sometimes we go to the other.

Chris12:29 I remember having a really dirty burger out of the car park.

Neil12:31 Yeah.

Chris12:33 At the end of the night. And then someone drove home. It was always. There was always a driver. There was someone who drove.

Neil12:37 Yeah.

Chris12:38 And there was never any taxis. That wasn't. What do you think?

Neil12:41 We just get text every now and then. But yeah, somebody would.

Chris12:43 There'll be a driver. And then there'd be a night out. And then there's one night. And I'm not going to say his real. His real name just in case he Listens. He doesn't listen, but in case he goes back to him. But it was Tim. Our friend Tim.

Neil12:53 No Tim's anymore.

Chris12:54 No, Tim's. No, he was. He got angry because his ex was there, all right. And then he blighted. Ruined the night for everybody because he was just angry because he'd saw his ex.

Neil13:03 Oh, dear.

Chris13:03 Yeah, he also. The best. The best memory of Tim is that he didn't. We know. Craig David.

Neil13:11 Craig David, yeah.

Chris13:12 Yeah. But he. He said Craig Davis. And the thing is, he said. He said it too many times so you couldn't correct him. So.

Neil13:23 Yes, is what it was.

Chris13:24 He just said it too many times. You know what I mean? Like, it gone on too long and no one corrected him. So he's like, right, that's what it is now. So he's like Craig Davis. And it's like it's. You just had to just. I. I remember everyone's looking at each other again. Oh, no.

Neil13:37 I remember sitting outside the Traveler's Rest and like one o' clock in the morning or whatever, and I was waiting for my mate to come out because we got separated. So I'm waiting for him to come out and this other lad came and sat because I was like sitting on the. Like on. On. On the curb. And this other lad came and sat next to me. He was properly wobbly, you know, and someone said, I look a lot of proper skinful. And he came and sat next to me. He's going, are you. Are you all right? I said, yeah, I'm good. You're all right. She's. Do you mind if I. I think he said, oh, I think I'm gonna be sick. Yeah, all right. And he just was sick. Yeah, he was just sick all over his shoes. And then my mate came over. What are you doing? So I'm watching this lady sick all over shoes. And then. Then we went and it was like. She was really polite, though. My. My friend Daz, when we were in Tamworth, we. We. We'd met these girls and they were this. We. We'd known him for like, eight, like, years, if you like, kind of. They were always out in Tamworth and stuff.

Chris14:30 Stuff.

Neil14:31 And anyway, one of them, he really, really, really liked. And anyway, one night she was like. She said, do you mind if, like, me and my mates come back with you? And we're like, oh, yeah. So we all go back to Daz's house and then our mate was there. He was from. Where was he from? He was. He wasn't from Tamworth. He Was. Oh, God. Anyway, he wasn't like, he didn't normally come out with us. Right. So he was there as like a, like a special, like a special guest kind of thing. And he was like a bit. He was like. He was a bit drunker than everybody and he was a little bit low. He's a little bit wary. Anyway.

Chris15:05 Yeah.

Neil15:06 And anyway, this girl, her name was Alexa.

Chris15:08 Yeah.

Neil15:10 I still. She absolutely looked like properly out of our league, you know, intelligent and mature and all of that stuff. Really pretty. She's sitting on the sofa with her mate and our mate was like sitting on the floor.

Chris15:21 Yeah.

Neil15:22 Near them.

Chris15:23 Yeah.

Neil15:24 And I saw him, he got this box of matches and he got this box of matches out and he lit one and he just, just like lit the bottom of a tassel under her jeans. And I could see it, you know, and you just like, your brain's really happening. Yeah, my brain's kind of running like quite slowly and I'm just like going, I don't think that's a good idea. And the flames just went, oh, like, just like a fireball. Really, really quick. Like, just. And it just up there. And then I grabbed like a, like a towel. Not a towel, like a cover thing from Dazzy's because it was a bit, it was a bit like. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris16:02 He had a.

Neil16:03 So I launched a throw over the poor girl and she wasn't on fire. Fire. It was just like, just the tasks, just a tassel to cut off. And of course Daz is like really, you know, he's really keen for this to progress. Well, you know, he's like, come on, lads, this has got. I want this to go really well. I know. Because he's like, he wasn't after. He wasn't after a one night stand with her. He was in love with it.

Chris16:24 Right.

Neil16:25 He really wants to like.

Chris16:26 Yeah.

Neil16:26 And then. Anyway, so I launched the throw over and then, and then like, it's a bit smoky and stuff and so. But it's all right. And we kind of go, do you know that for the big, for the size of the fireball, it's remarkably all right, you know, I mean, everybody's kind of okay. No real drama kind of okay. And then, and then Alexa just said, I think we should go now. And then we never ever spoke to them again.

Chris16:53 No, that's it.

Neil16:54 And they go. And then like, Daz just.

Chris16:56 Blaze of glory. That's what. That's.

Neil16:57 Honestly, it was still like years later, he was, would still like, like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Regale us with a Conversation of how he nearly is nearly future wife. We set on fire. It was always we as well. It was always like. Remember that time we set that girl on fire? I remember doing that. Yeah, Putting her out. There you go. But that was Tamworth. That was all good.

Chris17:25 Yeah, yeah. We're nearly at 20 minutes and we haven't discussed anything on the album.

Neil17:29 This. We're talking about pop punk, aren't we? We went down this kind of pop

Chris17:33 thing and actually, you know, this sort of stuff we're talking about was kind of got. What got them signed, really, their album.

Neil17:38 This album, all killer, no filler, 2001. It was released in that. In that world when they were. You think about like pop punk. But dookie was what, 94?

Chris17:55 Yeah, yeah. It was a few years later.

Neil17:57 There were a few like, killer records that had come out, but there wasn't a scene.

Chris18:02 Yeah.

Neil18:03 I think there was just a few big. Big pop punk bands.

Chris18:05 So hang on. This album in history came after American Idiot.

Neil18:14 Yeah. Oh, yeah, it did. He must know. Oh, God, now you're gonna make me.

Chris18:19 When did American Idiot come out?

Neil18:20 No, I'm gonna. I'm gonna look.

Chris18:21 Look, because what's now? Oh, I don't know.

Neil18:23 Now I'm gonna look for it. I know. I think I might have come.

Chris18:26 Is that later?

Neil18:27 Yeah, yeah, it definitely came out. That one's later. I think I'm looking on the Apple music, although it's not always right. I've noticed Apple music for its release dates. So where are we? We are American Idiot 2004.

Chris18:44 So it was a little bit later.

Neil18:45 Nimrod's 97, Insomniacs 95, Dookie's 94, Kaplunk 92.

Chris18:51 Right. So, yeah, it's a couple of years afterwards I just had that thing in my mind. But it wasn't because I always think of the year of where some 41's album came out.

Neil19:01 Yeah, as.

Chris19:02 As the same time as those other ones.

Neil19:05 I mean, kind of. They.

Chris19:06 It was funny like American Idiot was much later. Well, but it wasn't that much later.

Neil19:12 They were already massive though, right?

Chris19:13 Yeah, yeah.

Neil19:14 So, but one of the things interesting here is that those previous records had done really well. So you had Blink, you had Offspring, you had Green Day. All got big pop punk records that had sold well and were popular about this time. You had like MTV letting kids dial in and choose tracks that were going to be popular and stuff.

Chris19:40 Yeah.

Neil19:43 And so it all gets a little bit. It switches, I think, from. Gets a little bit more self service. So like those albums previously, they needed an A R man from some record company, you know, going, oh, I think this will sell out. Yeah, I think all those. The teenagers will like this. And. And Whereas here the teenagers were deciding what they wanted to listen to. And so. And it's funny because this. This album, all killer, no filler. They sent out. I think in 99, 2000, they sent demos of this out to all the record labels and they all were like, no, thanks, I'm not interested in that at all. They all wanted Linkin park or, you know, there were some super bigs if you made, like Puddle of Mud and Stain.

Chris20:31 Yeah, yeah.

Neil20:32 There was a bunch of stuff was really big on the. On the radio, like Linkin park and Nu Metal and like Limp Bizkit were massive. I don't think anybody really expected pop punk to be, you know, particularly big.

Chris20:46 Yeah, yeah. Or it'd be a fad, it coming in.

Neil20:48 Yeah. I think there was this perception. Don't know what you've really got time to say and not pretend can't make sense in what you thought Seems I can't comprehend I'm happy to be only all that you see and I'm not one to learn

Chris21:11 I don't want to

Neil21:11 hear you this no more I was better off a year before no matter how I try I can't ignore Every time I think my brain is sore why I'm with you. What's so hard about.

Chris21:35 I'm sorry.

Neil21:36 I'm just not as keen on planning out our perfect lives. When I'm only 19 I'm happy to be only all that you see and I'm no one to learn to be the same I don't want to try and just be friends Nothing's going to change my mind again and never there were thoughts I had the dead I can't even f. Inside my head when I'm waking.

Chris22:03 You.

Neil22:31 See that the truth so long can't stay Won't you see that the truth I run my way can't you see that the truth Someone can't say Won't you see the See that See that Lies that I can take because it's getting really hard to fake it's not like it's my problem. That's. Those to it. That day was the reason we started the band 741. Because we saw all our favorite bands like no Effects, Pennywise and just. I mean tons of bands Unwritten Law and we just thought, this is what we want to do. We want to be a band that can Play at the Warp Tour. So we started 741 the next day, or pretty much like, you know, that afternoon we said, you know, we're starting this band and here we go. We're going to one day get to the Warp Tour. And then we ended up doing the Warp Tour a bunch of times. Yeah, well, you get to hang out with a lot of those bands. I remember the first time we did, like, the whole thing was in 2001. And, you know, Fat Mike was on it, Rancid was on it. You know, there's just lots of bands. The year right before it, Green Day was on it.

Chris23:47 Yeah.

Neil23:47 And we. We did about two weeks of that. So you just get to be on tour with all these bands that you grew up listening to. Blink were big. Blink were kind of stadiums and stuff by this point. But. But this record. What eventually broke it with the record labels was a. They. They famously used to record themselves on vhs. So they used to literally go and record themselves doing stupid. So they would, like, you know, go and jump off something or, like, knock on people's doors. Yeah. Just dicking about, basically. And what they did was they spliced some of their live shows and the music with them running around shooting people with Super Soakers.

Chris24:33 Yeah.

Neil24:34 And I just. Basically just mucking about.

Chris24:37 Right.

Neil24:38 Their manager at the time hadn't seen these and saw this and thought, yeah, that's pretty cool. So cut some up and sent them off to the record labels. And then within a week, there was a massive bidding over the band.

Chris24:53 But they weren't interested previously.

Neil24:55 And it was. And it's funny, in the interview, they're like, there's nothing. Like. It wasn't like there was a different producer or the album ran in a different order or.

Chris25:04 Yeah, it's the same. The same record.

Neil25:06 It was literally exactly the same tape that we sent back out, but it just had this VHS tape with it and that, you know, it's just. They absolutely were desperate for it. And then MTV caught on, and then the kids started to hear it. And then it started to spiral and started to launch. And the. Because the band are from Canada. The band are from Ontario. And there was a point where they were unheard of in Canada and huge in the States. Only for about a year.

Chris25:39 Yeah.

Neil25:39 And then they kind of go back and. And it's in. They're big everywhere. But, yeah, it was. It was. It's a. It's a funny time. It's like the hijinks that. Like the. The American Pie.

Chris25:50 Yeah.

Neil25:51 If you think about that time and that.

Chris25:53 Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's all that stuff, isn't it?

Neil25:55 All of this fits into that kind of, you know, the. The Blink 182, running around naked and. And this era of. Of stuff was all about that. It was. It was just about, you know, just. Just being wild and crazy and. And almost trying to cause offense.

Chris26:15 Yes.

Neil26:15 You know, just trying to irritate people to get. To get traction somewhere. But it's funny. It's like that's what was happening, you know?

Chris26:26 I mean, if you.

Neil26:26 If you try to repeat that today, like, if you took that Blink 182 or you took the original video. I think they did it with motivation. I don't think it. Like, it wouldn't. It just wouldn't work. I think.

Chris26:41 Yeah, yeah.

Neil26:42 People just sigh. It would just be like, oh, really?

Chris26:44 But the. The kind of. The music videos and the concerts behind them and the songs, they were kind of synonymous, weren't they, with almost like the same products? It wasn't just like there was a song and it had a video.

Neil26:55 Yeah.

Chris26:55 It was like, because of the way we consume music back then, it was all music television.

Neil26:59 It was just the same.

Chris27:00 It was. You know, it was like people watched the song.

Neil27:03 Yeah, that's true. They did one as well, with. Just had all their fans in it.

Chris27:08 Yeah.

Neil27:08 So they just had them all. And there. And there was. There's famously no plan. They were just like, we're gonna do. We're gonna do this thing. You do what you want, and. And then they just let their fans go off and do. Do whatever they wanted to. Even the album cover for this album, I. I think has got that. Do you know what I mean? It's just the more Pulling funny faces.

Chris27:30 Yeah.

Neil27:31 Just being. I. It's really interesting because it looks.

Chris27:36 I think they were little like outtakes of those films of those.

Neil27:40 No, no, it looks like there's no. If you think about it, it looks like there's no album art plan, but actually it's epically good. Really. It really is such a good. Like, because it stands out.

Chris27:55 Legendary cover.

Neil27:56 I can find this cover. There's a handful of covers that you can. That are just really like. Dark side of the Moon's really easy to find. This is up there. I mean, if you think about Dark side of the Moon, it was done by. Oh, God.

Chris28:09 Oh, it was the. The studio, wasn't it?

Neil28:11 Yeah, the London studio. And I've forgotten the name. But anyway, they. They're a phenomenal studio. Like, you know, incredible artists who who kind of pulled all the ideas together for Dark side of the Moon. And then you've got this, which, like, for me, just.

Chris28:27 It.

Neil28:27 It's equally as good.

Chris28:29 Yeah.

Neil28:29 Do you know what I mean? It. It speaks.

Chris28:32 Iconic.

Neil28:33 Yeah. It speaks to exactly what the band. Like, you kind of know what you're gonna get just by looking at the COVID Yeah.

Chris28:40 Yeah.

Neil28:41 And I don't know. There's something in. I think. I don't know. It's.

Chris28:45 It.

Neil28:47 Like, if you look at albums now, I've been doing. We're gonna do a radio show in. In. In. Well, in. In the coming months, and we're going to do some new music on there. And it's been fascinating. There's some really cool new music, I think.

Chris29:01 Yeah.

Neil29:03 But I think the. The art of album art has been lost.

Chris29:10 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil29:10 Do you know what I mean? It's. It's either. It's either a. Like very clearly mid journey and AI generated artwork, which is not necessarily a bad thing, but it's. But that's. That. That's kind of what it is. Or it's like. Like just overly. It's just too much.

Chris29:29 Yeah.

Neil29:30 Joe. To me, it doesn't. It doesn't like, connect the things together. It's kind of like this artwork and then there's the.

Chris29:36 Yeah.

Neil29:37 And they don't really connect together, but the. The albums, for me, that, like, it's fun. It's funny. There's things like Sepulturas, Beneath the Remains.

Chris29:45 Yeah.

Neil29:46 It's got like that dark background. It's got the kind of red skull in there and then the album beneath them, and it just works.

Chris29:53 Yeah, yeah.

Neil29:53 The artwork wasn't done for the album. You know, the album wasn't done based on the album, but they kind of connected together and they make sense and they're simple and it works. It feels. And I know, like, trying to make it sound like it's easy, and I know it's not easy, but it. It does feel like that. The artwork. Thumbnails, if you like. Now it feels a bit throwaway.

Chris30:13 Yeah, yeah.

Neil30:14 And I do wonder if it's of this. I have this. Have this idea that it's because, like, back then the artwork was a big album and you would see it on big posters and you would see it in record shops. And so you could imagine that the agonizing over what it would look like at scale.

Chris30:35 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil30:35 And now it's a thumbnail in Spotify or Apple Music. It's an afterthought and it's it's more about being like, how does it stand out?

Chris30:44 Rather than like, oh, sorry, I see what you're saying.

Neil30:48 Does it connect. Does it actually connect to the.

Chris30:51 Yeah. Does it just pop off the screen when it's small so you can see what it is?

Neil30:55 Yeah.

Chris30:55 Yeah. Okay.

Neil30:56 Yeah. And I don't know. I'm gonna sound like a really grumpy old man, but I do kind of feel like that that's been lost a little bit. The album, like, I think the album of this year, and we talked about this before, is. I think they're pretty reckless. Dear God. Is. I don't. I think it's one of the best records. I think absolutely phenomenal record. The album art isn't.

Chris31:20 You know. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil31:21 It's all right. Yeah, it's all right. And I'm sure that they. You know, I'm sure there's a lot of thinking and thought over. And it's not terrible. By not, I don't mean it's terrible by any means. But it's funny. It's like. It just feels like a bit of a lost art.

Chris31:37 Yeah.

Neil31:38 Probably like recording to tape. I bet no one can do that anymore.

Chris31:40 No, no.

Neil31:41 Which, curiously, I don't know whether this went to tape or not, but I do know that Jerry Finn. So Jerry Finn produced this.

Chris31:49 And was it Jerry. Did you mention Jerry Finn produced a lot of stuff?

Neil31:52 Oh, did Jerry Finn produce. I'm going to open the Wikipedia. Let me open the Wikipedia page and I'm gonna tell you some artistes that he has worked with. So he's worked with the Muffs, Body Count, Green Day, Ash, the Goo Goo Dolls. He did A Boy Named Goo. She's very good. I've not gushed about the Goo Goo Dolls for ages. So if you think the Goo Goo Dolls are rubbish because you've only heard stuff from them on the radio in the last 10 years, go and listen to A Boy Named Goo and then come back to me and tell me the rubbish. Green Day, Pennywise, Rancid. He did slashes, Snake Pit, Weezer.

Chris32:35 It's that big American guitar stuff, isn't it? It's all that. Yeah.

Neil32:38 Incredible. This is like 96. I'm only up to 96. He did green Day's Good Riddance. He's just done just everything. He did the. What was the Blink song that ended up on American Pie? I can't remember. I can't remember what it was called. But there was. Anyway, there's one that went up to American Pie.

Chris33:08 Yeah.

Neil33:08 Did that MCPX Newfound Glory, some 41 alkaline trio, Bad Religion, Boxcar Racer. Like it just if you imagine like. But not only he's done a mixture of like mixing and co producing. Producing and engineering across all of these. Just absolutely awesome. Afi our client in that world just in.

Chris33:33 Just.

Neil33:34 But then. But then reading through this stuff. Then there's just the odd. Like Morrissey. Nancy Sinatra. No, they're. But they just.

Chris33:46 Yeah.

Neil33:47 You just can't. I can't imagine like Morrissey.

Chris33:50 Yeah.

Neil33:51 I can't imagine him sitting around I know. Crying into his. Whatever he probably. He's always miserable in Hemorrho says we'd be like, oh, I'm very miserable today. And you know I want to do a record. And then someone goes, I know what you want is the producer that's done all this pop punk. It doesn't make any. But like he did it but. And I think. I think you nailed at the beginning. He produces big thick guitars.

Chris34:17 Yeah.

Neil34:18 Because it is the. It's funny. It's the guitar sound that is. I think it's unique here because it's punk. The energy is quite punky. I think the. The culture and ethos behind this is punky. But it's not bone dry.

Chris34:36 It's not like it's big sounding.

Neil34:39 Yeah. It sounds like big hard rock.

Chris34:41 That's the Chris Lord Algae Algae style mix. It's all that sort of thing. And he did some of that stuff as well. You know, it's that big, quite compressed kind of guitar. You know, kick drum and snare drum. Really dominant.

Neil35:06 What's a difference I'm never knowing at all Whenever every step I take is always too small maybe it's just something I can't admit but lately I feel like I don't give a motivation Such an aggravation Accusations don't know how to take them Inspirations getting une Concentration never r to break it Situation never what you want it to be. What's the point of never making mistakes? Self indulge in such a hard habit to break it's all just a waste of time in the end don't care so why should I even pretend? Motivation such an aggravation Accusations don't know how to take them Inspiration's getting hard to fake it Concentration never r a break in Situation never what you wanted Nothing new keeps on dragging me Falling further behind no matter what you say Nothing's going to change my mind. Can't depend on till the end it seems like leaving friends and become mischievous no, I can't Pretend I'm fighting be this way it's not the same but who's the point for always doing things I never said. Accusations don't want to take them Inspirations getting uns concentration situation Never what you want it to be. Never what you wanted to be. Never what you wanted to be. I created an app because I wanted. Oh, I really like Vu Meters. And nothing has v. No. No. Nothing has called Vu Meters anymore, does it?

Chris37:40 No.

Neil37:41 And I thought, I'm gonna fix that. So I wrote an app for Apple Music that does vu meters for me. The one of the interesting things, and I hadn't thought about it, but it makes sense if you think about it. If stuff's really compressed, the needle just goes up.

Chris37:55 Yeah.

Neil37:56 Didn't dance around.

Chris37:57 Yeah. No, no.

Neil37:58 And it was funny. This one. This one does slam, right? I think it's more compressed than you'd think.

Chris38:05 Yeah.

Neil38:06 You know, when you. I think looking at the. The. The traces and stuff, but it sounds really good. But it's got that party sound to it, hasn't it? It's got this kind of. Of that.

Chris38:19 I think that's the. It's like the American rock party. That's the. It's that vibe, you know, and even looking, you know, the Andrew Wkd a bit later or whatever. But there was a bit that big, huge compressed guitar rock music. And I think it was. Yeah, it was all done by those guys, wasn't it? It all had that kind of, you know, similar people knocking around in the studios and all that sort of stuff. But it was interesting that one of the things that Derek Whibley said.

Neil38:48 Can I just say that? As names go.

Chris38:50 Yeah, that's it. It's a good.

Neil38:51 I really like Derek Ripley. Yeah, I think that's gonna be. Do you know his nickname is Busy D?

Chris38:57 Is it?

Neil38:58 Yeah, yeah. He wouldn't have been called that if he. If Busy D is such an American.

Chris39:03 Yeah.

Neil39:04 You know what I mean?

Chris39:05 Yeah.

Neil39:05 Like, if he'd have been Australian, I know he'd be like Wibbo. And if he was. If he was in England, he'd have been called Des.

Chris39:16 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil39:18 None of this. Busy day. It had been DEZ or Wibbo.

Chris39:22 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil39:23 Or something else completely, like, because he vomited on his mate shoes.

Chris39:29 But one of the things that he was talking about his. When they went into the studio to record this, you know, they thought they were a lot better than they actually were. And, you know, they were made to do retakes and they were Made to. No, no, no. That's not very good. You know, can. You need to do that. You need to play that better. And they really struggled with that. They really struggled with this, but it's there.

Neil39:49 It's not very punk, is it?

Chris39:50 No, no.

Neil39:51 Again, that's not very punk. It's. When we heard this before from a bunch of others bands in this. In this time where they're suddenly working with producers that, you know, they're producing. They're producing an album of work. They're not just recording what the band are doing. This. It's funny, isn't it, that there's a massive difference between, you know, just slamming down a. A mic and recording a band live, doing their thing, and recording an album. While producing an album.

Chris40:24 Yeah.

Neil40:25 Trying to think about how you want it to. To sound and. And knowing when it's not right. Knowing when it's not good enough. I mean, you get that from a lot of bands, though, when they.

Chris40:36 Yeah.

Neil40:37 You know what I mean? When they first go into the studio with a. With a big boy producer and all of a sudden get. You know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But even. It's funny, like, even the Def Leppard boys were saying that Mutlang would have him work on. Like, he said, this is funny. So she said, you're here in interview, Joe Elliott. It's going back quite a while now, but he. He was saying that in a lot of the press that. He said you'll hear it say things like, oh, we worked on a song for two days or three days. He said, we worked on one bit of one song. Song for a week. And he said, and it will be like. It would just be what would end up being like 20 seconds.

Chris41:19 Yeah.

Neil41:19 Of that song. And it would just go over and over and over and over and over. And then he said, he'll have one of you in the studio doing the same thing for two days.

Chris41:28 Yeah.

Neil41:29 You know, and then. And then he'll go and pick, like, the second take that you did.

Chris41:32 Yeah.

Neil41:33 And it just. Just crushed us. Like, we didn't. We didn't. We didn't anticipate that. Right. We. We thought that we'd go into the studio with Mark. We'd heard he was a bit of a taskmaster. Right. But we. We thought we'd go into the studio, he'd make us sound better. We didn't realize he was gonna make us play. He was gonna expect us to play back. You know, we didn't. We didn't expect that. But that album they were in the studio for nearly a year.

Chris42:01 Yeah.

Neil42:03 To do that and say.

Chris42:04 And it sounds like it as well, doesn't it? That's the thing.

Neil42:06 It's incredible. It's so polished.

Chris42:08 It's.

Neil42:08 It's. I don'. I mean, it's funny. It gets spoken about in, like, a really bad way. And I think that's because today music sounds super polished. Yes. Without much effort.

Chris42:20 Yeah.

Neil42:21 You know, the magic computer Pixies fix it.

Chris42:26 You know what I mean?

Neil42:27 So it doesn't make it sound as much fun. While we're on a tangent that we wander off a little bit on. I want to do the next. And we're talking about this now. I really want to do Nickelback. And the reason I want to do that is I've been listening to Nickelback quite a lot and they've got a new album coming out in October or whatever.

Chris42:51 Their music always. And this. They're Canadian, aren't they?

Neil42:54 Yeah.

Chris42:54 As well.

Neil42:54 Yeah. Yeah.

Chris42:55 So there's that.

Neil42:57 That's. That's. So when. When we talk about planning, let's assume. Let's assume we planned that. So it's funny. So they've got a new album out and one of the things I hadn't realized that I loved so much about Nickelback, that. That first couple of records that they did, they sound like it's a big American hard rock sound.

Chris43:27 Yeah.

Neil43:27 It's not super post. Not as polished as people think it's going to be. They don't sound like Def Leppard. They sound like an American hard rock band in a bar somewhere.

Chris43:36 Yeah.

Neil43:36 And you. The. The. The songs and the melodies are. The catchy is not like industrial catchiness from them. They sound like a. Like a. Like a cool band.

Chris43:48 Yeah.

Neil43:49 The new record that they've got sounds really polished.

Chris43:52 Right. Right.

Neil43:53 And it's funny. It was. It's. Yeah. It's really interesting. It's kind of between that and where they are now. Like, I know it's not cool to like Nickelback, but there's some that. I think something's got lost between the. That band.

Chris44:12 Yeah.

Neil44:13 From 2001 to. To the album that's going to come out now. It's. It sounds radically. It's not got the same vibe and feel to it. I think that they should have. It's a lot harder sounding as well.

Chris44:27 Is it?

Neil44:27 I think they should have. I think. I think what the world needs is. Is a Nickelback party album.

Chris44:36 Yeah.

Neil44:37 Not this harder. Uber polish.

Chris44:40 Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Neil44:40 Almost metal sound.

Chris44:42 Yeah.

Neil44:42 Record. But. Yeah. It's Interesting. I think the, the, the product, the production of the day back in 2001 was interesting. Some massive guitars and it was, it was about this. Creating the energy and the party atmosphere. Yeah. Which I mean, quite clearly Jerry, Jerry Finn managed to, to play was a bit of a master at doing so. But this out. I mean this. For me, this album still sounds great today.

Chris45:09 Yeah.

Neil45:10 So I think it sounds. Some albums just. But we talked about this loads in the past. Some albums sound quite thin.

Chris45:18 Yeah.

Neil45:18 From what? Because we, we cover everything. It's got to be 25 years old or more. So some albums, the production can sound a little bit too, too fast. Especially when you're back into like, I would say like the early 90s a little bit.

Chris45:32 Yeah.

Neil45:34 But this area was. Everything was just huge and thick and you know, that kind of

Chris45:42 the thing is as well, they spent money on the records.

Neil45:46 Well, yeah, that's a good point. Because money, you could make money. This was like peak CD era, just running into like Napster and MP3.

Chris45:54 Yeah.

Neil45:55 Becoming a big deal here.

Chris45:57 But there's budget. There's budget to make a record. Yeah. I remember talking, talking about, you know, I know we're talking about, you know, not Canada or not America, but you know, people go into Rockfield, for example, for like six months.

Neil46:09 Yeah.

Chris46:09 To record, to put a record down, you know, and, and like the, the com. The record companies would spend, you know, the day rate for six months and they would live at the studio and then they come out with an album possibly.

Neil46:22 But you, you would. You, you. The payback was on the physical album. So it was on. It was on buying CDs.

Chris46:29 Yeah.

Neil46:29 And I think this. So we're 2001. It's on the decline now.

Chris46:33 Yeah. Yeah.

Neil46:34 So we're starting to see this. This is Lars Oric.

Chris46:37 Yeah.

Neil46:38 You know, attacking everybody saying, you know,

Chris46:41 it's terrible and look at what's coming. Yeah. Yeah.

Neil46:43 And you're going to destroy the music industry. And isn't it, isn't it all terrible?

Chris46:48 And he was right.

Neil46:49 Well, I mean he, I think he could see where. I mean, it's funny because at this point no one could really see like itunes.

Chris46:59 Yeah. It wasn't, it wasn't. There was no sign of anything like Spotify at the time.

Neil47:03 No itunes. And then because you had Napster and you had Limewire and you had like all of these kind of computery connecty things, which still amuses me that we used to do this, but. And people forget that the vast majority of this was happening over dial Up. Yeah, like this. You. You were. You were using your phone on a modem, not broadband like you have today, where it's like a super fast. You know, you. It would take a week to download an album and then it probably turned out to be a virus or something. If you look, it might be some porn and a virus, but, you know, it was a weird time, wasn't it? You know, and then. And then the, the changes. But this is probably almost that last era, like you say, where record companies were dishing out.

Chris47:51 Yeah.

Neil47:51 You know, big, big chunks of cash to go and record albums that they could. It's way past my bedtime. It's nearly 11 o'.

Chris48:01 Clock. I mean, that's good going. Is it?

Neil48:03 It is. But. But the, the record companies were making the money back off the record sales, not off. I mean, today they make no money off the record sales and the money comes in off tickets and merch and all that sort of merch, isn't it? Most. I mean, I suppose there's, there's, there's tickets for. But I saw that a ton of tours have been canceled over in Europe.

Chris48:26 Yeah, tours, festivals. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Loads of stuff.

Neil48:30 Incredibly hard to. To, to. To make any, any money without charging like 100 quid a ticket for. For a show, you know, and.

Chris48:39 Yeah, well, production's not getting any cheaper.

Neil48:41 Yeah, yeah, production's not getting any cheaper and everything's getting next, you know, so. But if you want to go to a gig, you've got to pay, like, 10 quid a pint. You've got to pay. I, I saw somebody complaining about the Gojira merch, I think. Did they do blood? I can't remember who did Bloodstock, but somebody's complaining about the 90 quid. Yeah, hoodies.

Chris49:01 Yeah.

Neil49:03 And it's funny. You're like, well, yeah, 90 quid's a lot for a hoodie, but you're not. No one's paying. No one's paying any money for the music.

Chris49:11 Yeah, yeah.

Neil49:12 So, yeah, I suppose music is. Arguably, music is cheaper to make now than it. Than it was then, but, yeah, it is a complete. It's funny, it's a completely different industry.

Chris49:23 Yeah, yeah, yeah, it totally is.

Neil49:25 I always remember that quote from Kiss. It might be from Gene Simmons and someone, Someone asked him, what. What was the. If you could like, give your younger self, you know, like a lesson right, from what, you know now.

Chris49:43 Yeah.

Neil49:44 You know, about rock and roll, what would it be? And he said, oh. I said, I don't really know anything about rock. And roll. We're basically a T shirt salesman. I just remember, like, just thinking, oh, what? But it's.

Chris50:00 It's true.

Neil50:01 They. And again, that. That's a band that. I mean, from the. They nailed the. That understanding.

Chris50:07 Yeah, yeah.

Neil50:08 Where the money came.

Chris50:09 Selling the show, they're selling the merch, they're selling the figures, they're selling the posters, the artwork, the characters, the. Yeah, they built. They built the whole machine.

Neil50:16 It's funny, isn't it? And I think nowadays. Yeah, that's just, you know, the. The, like the music is the lead in, isn't it? It's kind of like that. That's the hook to then. And then you've got to have like. I was reading something about Spirit Box and they were saying that they're. They sell tons of. Of merch. Obviously, the music's great and, you know, but a large part of that is their image, the band image. It's Cornella Plant and having, you know, and. And the way the band are and the way they've engaged with the, you know, the younger generation. And then people like, well, I want to be associated with them. So off, you know, off they go and buy. Buy the merch. So it's everything. It's kind of. It's, you know, you. The music is one part of it that kind of gets you hooked in. Then it's just your. Your reputation and your brand.

Chris51:11 Yeah.

Neil51:11 And then that encourages kids to kind of, you know, come and buy your. Your merch. Which, you know, I'm talking about it like it's a change, but actually, like, if you think about some. Some 41.

Chris51:25 Yeah.

Neil51:26 Them being. And squirting people with guns.

Chris51:29 Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was the beginning of it.

Neil51:30 That was all part of that. And then you would be like, oh, they're really cool.

Chris51:34 There's some 41 hoodie.

Neil51:35 Yeah, yeah. I'm gonna go and do the same thing. So I suppose it's always been the same.

Chris51:39 Yeah, yeah.

Neil51:40 But they got paid for the album as well.

Chris51:42 Yes. Yeah.

Neil51:43 So maybe people get paid less.

Chris51:44 Yeah, yeah.

Neil51:45 Could you buy hoodies? But hoodies were. I remember hoodies been really hard to get hold of.

Chris51:48 I remember people wearing some 41 shirts, though.

Neil51:52 Oh, yeah, yeah.

Chris51:53 I remember the people wearing the gear. You know, I remember that as well.

Neil51:56 What I always used to find difficult that you go to a show and you'd be able. You'd see T shirts.

Chris52:01 Yeah.

Neil52:01 But it was always hard to get hoodies.

Chris52:03 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil52:04 I always liked hoodies. I was. I was a bit of. I Was a hoodie wearer.

Chris52:07 Yeah.

Neil52:07 Jogging. You're a hoodie. You're. You know.

Chris52:09 Yeah, I do like a hoodie. Yeah.

Neil52:10 I like to.

Chris52:12 But I like a hoodie with a zip.

Neil52:14 I'm a bit. I'm a bit of a mixture.

Chris52:16 Yeah.

Neil52:16 So I like. I do like a zip hoodie.

Chris52:19 Yeah.

Neil52:19 I have to be honest, I'm. I'm with you on that one. My favorite thing is in the winter.

Chris52:25 Yeah.

Neil52:25 From. From working on code or I'm doing something like that. Needs a bit of concentration. I put my big headphones on and I put my hood up like a hacker and I imagine like Mr. Robot or. Or Neo. And that's what I do. And then I go into the.

Chris52:47 Does he coding it better as well?

Neil52:49 Yeah.

Chris52:49 Does it?

Neil52:49 Yeah, it's that good?

Chris52:50 Yeah, yeah.

Neil52:50 It's like drinks, like. It's like drinking.

Chris52:52 Yeah.

Neil52:52 Do you mean if you. If you. All of that. It just. It just makes you better. But it's funny. It's. It's really funny. It's. I mean, crazy. Christ knows what I. Look if somebody walked past my house and see me with my hood up on my head, she's just like. But I. I don't know. I really like that. I'm a big fan of the hoodie. Yeah, it's good. I forget sometimes what's on my hoodies, though.

Chris53:13 Yeah.

Neil53:13 You know, you are. I get in that state.

Chris53:15 Yeah, yeah.

Neil53:16 And then there's a team's call.

Chris53:17 Oh. And you've got to be professional.

Neil53:18 Yeah, I've got like a. I know, like a Slayer hoodie on or prong hoodie on or whatever. And you're like, oh, I better.

Chris53:25 Yeah.

Neil53:26 And you get the. Oh, Neil, can you put your camera on? Oh, I'm really sorry, my camera's not working.

Chris53:30 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil53:32 You know.

Chris53:33 Yeah. We can't see you.

Neil53:36 Yeah. No, you don't want to.

Chris53:37 Yeah.

Neil53:37 Could you just kill yourself instead? Sorry. Leave me alone. Stop asking me to do this stuff. Oh, we really want to see you. No, you don't. I'll pick my nose.

Chris53:48 Yeah.

Neil53:49 Or something. I just. I don't. I don't like that at all.

Chris53:52 No.

Neil53:52 That's the modern world, isn't it? Yeah, I don't like that.

Chris53:55 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil53:56 I don't mind the calls. Yeah, no, I'm all right with that.

Chris53:58 I don't like being on the film. Film on camera. I don't like it.

Neil54:01 I don't like it either. Rubbish.

Chris54:04 I'm still listening to what they're on. About.

Neil54:06 Yeah. But they don't know you're listening. That's the thing, isn't it? I've often want. I've wandered off.

Chris54:11 Yeah.

Neil54:12 I find. I do find it difficult, you know. You know, when we were on, like a work call.

Chris54:17 Because they get boring, don't they? Some of them.

Neil54:19 Oh, God. When somebody's. Some like, there'll be. There'll be a conversation about something and, I don't know, whatever the topic is. Right. And there'll be like a conversation and then there'll be some ideas about that topic.

Chris54:36 Yeah.

Neil54:38 And then someone else will say something and I think, yeah, that's great. That's done now.

Chris54:44 Yeah.

Neil54:44 I mean, those two bits. That person said their thing. That person said their thing. I might make a little note in my pad.

Chris54:50 Yeah.

Neil54:51 I'll be like, okay, it's good. And there's always one.

Chris54:53 Yeah. That carries it on.

Neil54:55 I just like to echo. What?

Chris54:56 Yeah, don't do the echoing.

Neil54:59 Like, I just. There's no need for you to echo. There's no need. That. Or be like, I just want to jump on. Oh, I just want to jump in. There's no jumping. Yeah. I'd like you to not do that, please.

Chris55:12 No, no, no.

Neil55:13 You just. It's all. I don't know. I think sometimes it's like, I agree.

Chris55:17 Like, I agree. You don't need to say that you agree.

Neil55:20 Yeah, yeah. If I didn't agree, I'd say so.

Chris55:23 Yeah.

Neil55:23 Let's assume that. Move on to something else. And then it's just like, I think they just have to hear the sound of their own voice or it's like, if I don't say something, people think I wasn't listening.

Chris55:33 Yeah. Yes. Yeah, that's.

Neil55:35 And so everybody's got to echo.

Chris55:36 Yeah.

Neil55:37 Well. And you just.

Chris55:38 Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, yeah. And then you're echoing the echo.

Neil55:42 It is especially like. Especially if you. If you found a banging album.

Chris55:45 Yeah.

Neil55:45 And you want to listen to it and you're stuck on the teams call, so you're like, I just want you all to stop speaking.

Chris55:54 Yeah.

Neil55:54 Can we just, like, fast forward through this a little bit? Like, do you know what I mean? It's like, I reckon I could probably get through this whole thing in five minutes.

Chris56:01 Yeah.

Neil56:01 If you just would all stop echoing and.

Chris56:03 Yeah.

Neil56:04 Or I don't. The modern business world is too weird. There's too much of that.

Chris56:09 Yeah.

Neil56:10 Too much. I, like, like, the last few weeks, I've been really enjoying Bring Me the Horizons. And almost every teams call, I've Been on. I've been thinking. Prefer to listen to that the second this is over. Do you know what I mean?

Chris56:26 Yeah.

Neil56:27 And I don't, I don't. I'm sure this is very important that we echo, but I don't. I'd rather listen to the album instead. Please. Thank you. Yeah, but there you go. Modern world. What were the kids? What were the kids like? I, I. Could you have imagined. I couldn't have imagined this. When I started work, what they would

Chris56:45 be saying going, oh, can you stop echoing now?

Neil56:47 Yeah, just think about 2001. This album came out. I was working in data centers.

Chris56:51 Yeah.

Neil56:51 I, Somebody, somebody reminded me. Actually this was the year I got a man, an antivirus specialist stuck in a revolving door and had to call maintenance to take the door apart heart to relieve him from it. He was. We had a really big problem with viruses and he was obviously really good at. This is just what was happening at

Chris57:19 that time, capturing viruses.

Neil57:21 That time. Yeah, that time. This, this time of the year, like 2000, 2001. 2002. We. It was really difficult. There was. They had all kinds of issues with viruses. It's as the world. And the Internet opened up business. Right. And we started to get emails and other bits and pieces and it was a real problem. And anyway, my, my job was to go and solve it. And we had a, an antivirus consultant come to talk to us, come to see us. And my job was to kind of understand and go and, you know, basically go and go and fix, fix all the problems. Anyway, he turned it. We had these, like. We went to the data center. And in the data center back then, nowadays you'd have a turnstile.

Chris57:57 Yes.

Neil57:57 But back then it was like a solid wall.

Chris58:00 Yeah.

Neil58:00 With these two. Imagine like two. Imagine like. Well, there was like six of these like plastic tubes just big enough to put a human in and that the front door would open, it would like, like Star Trek. And you got in it and then it would close behind you and then the front would go and you could get out, right?

Chris58:17 Yeah, yeah. Airlock.

Neil58:19 Yeah, basically an airlock. And that's what, that's what it was for. And it went into the, the. It didn't go in straight into the data center, but it went into the rooms that you, you could get into the data center from. So anyway, I go and pick this guy up.

Chris58:30 Fuel, the festive fuel.

Neil58:32 Gotta pick this guy up.

Chris58:33 Atrium. Atrium, that's what.

Neil58:34 Atrium.

Chris58:35 That's what they're all called.

Neil58:36 That is.

Chris58:37 Yeah.

Neil58:37 Sounds Greek, Latin. It's got a Bit Latin, one of them. Anyway, so I picked the guy up and I took him up and we'd gone into the. Where the. The room was. We were going to talk about viruses and he'd got about five laptops. Laptop. But, yeah, you know when. Back then. Yeah, laptops. And your laptop bag was massive. Yeah, yeah. Imagine like five. You had like five of them everywhere. So anyway, we both. We both get into our tubes and then my tube gets. Then his went. And I thought, oh, that's interesting. Made a funny noise. And then mine opened and his didn't open. So I stepped forward and turned round and what had happened is, as the door had closed behind him.

Chris59:17 Oh, it trapped the thing.

Neil59:18 It had kind of swizzled one of his laptop bags around, which had pressed one of the other laptop bags against the front.

Chris59:24 Yeah, yeah.

Neil59:25 Door.

Chris59:25 Yeah.

Neil59:26 So he's now stuck in there. He's got like, laptop bags either side of him pressing in against the. The front door now can't open and the back door can't open. It's completely wedged in against the thing.

Chris59:37 The maintenance, just for the cinematic. Cinematic effects, a sprinkler went off and then it just started filling.

Neil59:44 Can you imagine that? And then. But then the alarm does go off.

Chris59:47 Yeah.

Neil59:47 Right. So the. The. The alarm goes off and then the maintenance man comes out and tries to break it open with a screwdriver.

Chris59:55 Yeah.

Neil59:55 Because that's, you know. So if it's a screwdriver comes in there and then at this point, just one tube is broken.

Chris1:00:01 Right.

Neil1:00:02 The one with my antivirus consultant in.

Chris1:00:04 Yeah, yeah.

Neil1:00:05 And he gets the screwdriver and starts trying to prize the front of the door. And then the system thinks it's being attacked. Physically attacked.

Chris1:00:12 Yeah.

Neil1:00:13 So then it closes all of the tubes down. So then we've got like the maintenance guy who's on my side with me inside the data center center. The ladders that the other maintenance guys brought, which we need to use to kind of. On the other side of the tubes, no one can get in or out because you're in a sealed thing and the antivirus consultant is still wedged in the tube. It was there for ages. Like two hours. It was there really. It went on and it was really funny. My, like, you know when people get given nicknames that. That was the one that I got. You know, remember that time you got that guy stuck in the tube? I didn't get him. I just. I just watched him get stuck in the tube.

Chris1:00:57 Is he called Daz?

Neil1:00:59 I don't know what Is. I feel like I should know his name.

Chris1:01:01 Yeah, yeah.

Neil1:01:02 I don't. I don't know his name. Lovely guy. Really Scottish guy. Yeah, really genuinely lovely. Yeah, genuinely. Really lovely guy.

Chris1:01:12 You trapped him in a tube.

Neil1:01:13 Trapped him in a tube. And then when he was released from the church tube, like, I thought you might imagine. Imagine you trap like a wasp. Yeah. And then when you release the wasp, it's a bit grumpy.

Chris1:01:24 Yeah.

Neil1:01:25 And you're like, I'm gonna step back and let the wasp just go somewhere else on it. And I thought, this. This man's gonna be quite angry because he's been wedged in this. And he didn't look very happy while he was wedged in there, to be honest. And when we came out, I was like, do you want, like, a cup of tea or something? He's. Oh, that would be really great. Yeah, thank you. And he was lovely. Absolutely lovely. Lovely. Really, really lovely guy. Interestingly, the next time we were supposed to meet, he said, could you come to Oxford and I'll show you our hq?

Chris1:01:54 Yeah.

Neil1:01:54 And I was. I. All my mates were like, going, you're never getting out. Just gonna trap you in some way. You're going to be trapped in polycarbonate somewhere, like. And they'll keep you forever as I go.

Chris1:02:08 Yeah.

Neil1:02:08 You know.

Chris1:02:09 Yeah.

Neil1:02:09 This is the one that did it.

Chris1:02:10 Yeah.

Neil1:02:11 But he didn't. It was lovely and it was great and. Yeah.

Chris1:02:14 And you didn't get trapped in the two. No.

Neil1:02:16 Don't have them anymore, apparently. Again, a weird conversation this week, but someone was saying they don't do that anymore.

Chris1:02:22 They don't.

Neil1:02:23 Nope. They have what's called turnstile, like, normal places, apparently. It was really. It was really popular in old mainframe data centers.

Chris1:02:32 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil1:02:33 No one cares. Yeah, they were. They were. Back then, the data centers were Star Trek. They were completely sealed, like, totally sealed. You couldn't get air and everything was all filtered. And remember, I remember having this talk about the data center. And it's like, if the alarm goes off, then the heavy gas falls and you've got like 12 seconds to get out or you'll die. You just got to get out. And. And then you get this big, like, you know, here are the exits, here's what's going to happen. And you could just make it. It's the size of a football fit. The size of a football. Football pitch, right. So. So if you were at one end, you needed to get, like, almost, you know, the length of a football pitch and. And out of the door, right? And which is a bit scary. So, like, we.

Chris1:03:24 You.

Neil1:03:24 You used to find. When we were positioning servers, we always used to position them near the door because we were all scared to death that this thing was gonna happen. We're gonna die. But what absolutely killed me one. One year we were in there in the summer and there were pigeons in there. Literally pigeons flying around in the hermetically sealed death data center. And you could just see everyone. Like, why do they, why are they p. How, how are the pigeons in here?

Chris1:03:54 Yeah.

Neil1:03:55 I don't know whether they still do that.

Chris1:03:56 They get everywhere, don't they?

Neil1:03:57 Yeah.

Chris1:03:57 Maybe there were carrier pigeons.

Neil1:03:58 Maybe that's why data centers use so much water. Is the pigeons.

Chris1:04:05 Maybe. Yeah. Maybe it's not really kind of like silicon and wires. Maybe it's just pigeons.

Neil1:04:09 Just pigeons.

Chris1:04:09 AI is just pigeons.

Neil1:04:11 That'd be brilliant, wouldn't it?

Chris1:04:12 Yeah, yeah.

Neil1:04:12 They just fly about squawking, you say,

Chris1:04:15 claude, sort this out.

Neil1:04:16 And it's just a pigeon.

Chris1:04:17 And then pigeon flies from one bit to another finds.

Neil1:04:19 I think it's a bit like. Is it like the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, you know, where. When mice.

Chris1:04:24 Yeah.

Neil1:04:24 Turn out to be hyperglycemy? Maybe it's pigeons.

Chris1:04:27 I think so.

Neil1:04:27 I think we've gone off. Off tangent. We've gone. We've gone more offshore. I don't know. We've done a bit of talk about the album.

Chris1:04:37 We're an hour in. We're about an hour.

Neil1:04:40 So should we jump to talk about some facts? I will do. I was going to do some fact earlier.

Chris1:04:44 Yeah.

Neil1:04:44 But my glasses were a bit blurry. But I've just cleaned them.

Chris1:04:48 Yeah. Let's do facts then we'll do a song I'll like. Because we have done this straight. Sometimes we do little chunks.

Neil1:04:53 Oh, that was the other question. Yeah, the talking about podcasts and stuff. And she was like, so how do you edit? How do you use. How do you get rid of the ums and ers and all of that stuff? And, you know, you just like going, what? What do you mean? So genuinely she said, well, when. If somebody, like people are manure, don't they. When they're talking? And she said, people don't like hearing that. And, you know, I'm like, I, I, I don't know. Genuinely, I have no idea what you're talking about. Like, just what. So, yeah, so obviously we're very professional.

Chris1:05:32 Yeah, we're so good. We don't need to get.

Neil1:05:35 Have we undine, though? Have you? Do you?

Chris1:05:38 I don't know. I do. I do edit some podcasts where I do do that. I do edit the. And the ums sometimes, but not as.

Neil1:05:46 I don't know if we do it. Do we do it?

Chris1:05:48 Oh, yeah, absolutely. 100%.

Neil1:05:49 Oh, good.

Chris1:05:50 But. But not so much and to the point where we have to get rid of the thingy.

Neil1:05:55 I think I like to. I like to think of our show as like being an analog.

Chris1:05:59 Yeah.

Neil1:05:59 This is like an analog live recording.

Chris1:06:02 Yeah.

Neil1:06:03 Like this is more, you know, like a live rock band.

Chris1:06:07 Yeah.

Neil1:06:07 You don't want to be like, you know, Pro Tools in you do you want to be like.

Chris1:06:12 Yeah, yeah. Although we are recording in ProTools. But that. But we don't do. We don't.

Neil1:06:16 It's only because you like the WYSI waves that it gives.

Chris1:06:18 I do like that. I keep looking every now and then just. Yeah.

Neil1:06:22 Right. Shall I talk about some things?

Chris1:06:24 Yes, yes. So if you do facts and then we'll do. Because I'll put some songs in before and the interviews before. Yeah, now edit that in and then we'll do the facts and then we'll do another song and then we'll talk about next week. But we've already spoken about next week, so.

Neil1:06:39 Oh, yeah. Yeah. I really want to do Nickelback. Can we do that? Is that right?

Chris1:06:43 Yeah, that's fine.

Neil1:06:44 Things you might not know about this album. Do you know where the Name came from? Some 41.

Chris1:06:51 No, I've got a clue.

Neil1:06:52 Some 41. It said they counted the days from the start of the school summer holiday to the Warped Tour date that they

Chris1:07:01 wanted to go on.

Neil1:07:02 And it was 41. That's where the. That's where the name. The name came from.

Chris1:07:07 And they ended up on the Warp tours, didn't they?

Neil1:07:09 They ended up on the Warp tours in the future. One of their engineers, Joe McGregor Grath, as they were recording it mid session, said that the record was all killer, no filler, Brilliant. And that's where the name came from. My own house party cuz nobody came I know I'm not the one you thought you knew back in high school Never going, never showing up when we act to attention that we grave don't tell us to behave I'm sick of always hearing at your age I don't want to waste my time Become another casualty of society I'll never fall in line Become another victim of you. Because you don't know us at all we left with all people fall but what would you expect with a content

Chris1:08:17 so small Heavy metal and mullet it's

Neil1:08:19 how we were raised Maiden and freeze we're the gods that we pray Gods we like having fun at other people's expense and shutting people down is just a minor offense and it's none of your concern I guess I'll never look I'm sick of being told to win My turn I don't want to waste my time Become another casualty of society I'll never fall in line Become another victim of your poor body and back down. Don't count on me to let you know when don't count on me I'll do it again don't count on me it's the point you're missing don't count on me,

Chris1:09:21 Gang don't say.

Neil1:09:40 Become another casualty of society I'll never fall in line Become another fit out loud Nickel. The label had In Too Deep penciled as the lead single. Single. And it was the band that pushed for Fat Lip. It's funny.

Chris1:10:19 In Too Deep was written when one of the guys was late because.

Neil1:10:22 Yeah. Quite often. Yeah. They were just kind of bored and waiting. Into Deep's funny because they didn't play it live for like nine years or something.

Chris1:10:33 Wow.

Neil1:10:34 And one of the reasons was because Wibbo, I'm going to call him now, felt that it was too simple.

Chris1:10:48 Yeah.

Neil1:10:48 And that it wasn't. He didn't. Didn't. Didn't feel like it was a good song. So they. They didn't banger. It's funny, isn't it?

Chris1:10:56 Yeah, yeah, yeah. If I ever think of it, that's. That's the song I think of.

Neil1:11:04 The two second false ending in Fat Lip was objected to by the record label and they said it would kill. Kill radio play. But it stayed and. And it didn't.

Chris1:11:17 Which is fine because what radio can do is they can just turn it down or talk.

Neil1:11:24 It gets your attention a bit.

Chris1:11:25 Yeah.

Neil1:11:25 Yeah. The band were coached in rapping by MC Shan, a veteran New York MC at a studio in Scarborough, Ontario.

Chris1:11:35 I thought you meant rapping with a W then.

Neil1:11:37 Wap. Wapping.

Chris1:11:39 No, no, as in like wrapping things up.

Neil1:11:40 Oh, wapping things up.

Chris1:11:42 Yeah. So like wrapping presents.

Neil1:11:43 I watched a YouTube video about how Chinese department stores wap. It was epic. It was. You know when you stumble on something and you just. I was watching this Chinese lady and she was. She was rapping.

Chris1:12:03 I thought it was amazing as well.

Neil1:12:05 Oh. It was just not. It was just like, I like abs. I went back and watched it again. I was like, this has got to be fake. How she's doing It. But it's just incredible.

Chris1:12:13 Yeah.

Neil1:12:13 Really impressive.

Chris1:12:14 She just looked at it and then put a hand like Jedi and then it was done.

Neil1:12:17 It was a bit perfect.

Chris1:12:19 Yeah.

Neil1:12:19 Just like. Yeah, just really nice. And then, you know when you, like, have to do rapping at Christmas and I just don't.

Chris1:12:28 Mate. It's just. It's not worth it. It's not. It's not. It's like.

Neil1:12:34 I like. You kind of scrunched all the paper

Chris1:12:36 up and you're like.

Neil1:12:38 Just sand it over.

Chris1:12:39 Like.

Neil1:12:40 It's not pretty much it. It's not a bomb.

Chris1:12:45 Yeah. No. The running joke in our household is that how can somebody who's so good at, like, quite intricate things with a guitar.

Neil1:12:51 Yeah.

Chris1:12:51 Be so absolutely useless at everything, not be able to.

Neil1:12:54 But I think it's. Is it a weaponized incompetence? I think that's.

Chris1:12:58 I think it is. Yeah.

Neil1:13:00 I don't like doing this, so I'll not.

Chris1:13:03 Yeah.

Neil1:13:07 Rodney Dangerfield. So. So.

Chris1:13:09 Oh, God, They've just got the best names. Rodney Dangerfield.

Neil1:13:16 So there were two cameos that they wanted on this album for the videos. One of them was Rodney Dangerfield, who they wanted in him to appear in a video parodying his own film. And the other one was no Effect's Fat Mike, who should have been the diving coach. You know, in the video where there's like the. The hunks are kind of the divers and then there's the. The. Some 41 boys. And then they got then. So that they. Fat Mike was supposed to be the diving coach and didn't do it. Don't know why. To just say he doesn't do it. At the 2002 Junos. Junos, which is like a awards thing. The album lost best album to Diana Krall and the best album to Nickelbacks. And then. I don't know if I know that. I know this came up in a few different places and it's in the blog, but Kerry King played the solo on the recut what We're all about, which went to the Spider man soundtrack in 2000. Spider Man 2. Oh, God.

Chris1:14:33 Spiderman, Spiderman, Superman, Batman.

Neil1:14:36 Did you. Did you see. Did I send you. I've sent you some killer memes in the last week and you just, like. You've not really engaged me. Them. But like, there's one of them where that guy speaks Yorkshire.

Chris1:14:51 Yeah. Yeah. Amazing.

Neil1:14:52 The American guy.

Chris1:14:53 So good.

Neil1:14:54 Oh, it just killed me. Absolutely killed me. And I just thought that's. That's. That's what I. Yeah, that's what I needed. I needed that. I needed a man, an American man pretending to be.

Chris1:15:04 Yeah, that was outstanding.

Neil1:15:05 It was epic, wasn't it? It was really good. I'm kind of tempted to see if I can find it. I bet I can't find it now.

Chris1:15:10 Now.

Neil1:15:11 I bet I can't find it. I bet I'm going to see if I can find it. Oh, it's there. I found it.

Chris1:15:18 You have to put it near the mic if we're going to.

Neil1:15:20 I'm going to do it to people who aren't British, from Yorkshire.

Chris1:15:40 Oh, it's so good.

Neil1:15:41 That's what. If you're from Yorkshire and you're wondering, like, that's what you sound like. And so that's. That's it. Yeah. Thank you very much. And that's kind of it for. There's loads of other things about that. I'll make some other bits, actually.

Chris1:15:56 Yeah.

Neil1:15:58 So it was released on 8 May 2001, recorded in Metalworks, um, studios and also in Los angeles. It's got 13 tracks. We got 14 in the UK. It's got the one on the end where they make fun of Iron Maiden. I, I, I never, never knew if it was officially that they were making fun of Iron man, but it does sound a lot like Maiden that they're making fun of.32 minutes long, which is about the right length, I think, for now.

Chris1:16:23 Yeah. That's short, isn't it? They're little songs.

Neil1:16:26 Yeah, yeah. Very punky, aren't they?

Chris1:16:28 Yeah, yeah.

Neil1:16:30 Singles Fat Lip into Deep Motivation, which, you know, it's like, for a debut. It's not a bad songs, aren't they?

Chris1:16:42 All the time when we do these things, you think they were like 20 years old. 19, 20 years old. Just riding bangers like that.

Neil1:16:47 It's funny, all of the videos of them basically getting their face too close to the camera.

Chris1:16:50 Yeah.

Neil1:16:51 If you watch the videos, it's all of them just kind of slamming their face, faces right into the camera. Wibbo still says it's a crap album still to this day, still talks about it not being a very good record and doesn't think it's a good album and, you know, doesn't really get what all the fuss is about, which I think is really interesting.

Chris1:17:09 Yeah, it is.

Neil1:17:10 And that's it for Facts for that. So we've done, we've done facts, we've talked about records, we've talked about vomit, we've talked about setting fire to people, about getting exquisitely talented and very professional people. Stuck in plastic tubes. What else have we talked. We talked about loads of stuff.

Chris1:17:27 Yeah, yeah, it's great.

Neil1:17:28 The AI, when we get the, the, when, when you get this, if you're listening to this, it's worth going into your podcast app and looking at the description because we have AI, we force it to listen to the show and then generate the description.

Chris1:17:45 And it's always. That's like our little reward, isn't it? It, the tangential. Tangent. Tangential Gold. Is that the right word? Yeah, that said that, right?

Neil1:17:54 Yeah.

Chris1:17:55 It always has a little section where it says, what have they, what have they?

Neil1:17:58 As well.

Chris1:17:58 We feel like it's a nice, like you go, but, oh yeah, we did talk about. That was stupid.

Neil1:18:02 Oh God, that was stupid. Why are we talking about that? Well, there you go. That's. Do you know that's the other thing that a professional podcaster would do? Yeah, they'd cut 90% of the show out, wouldn't they? You think they do it?

Chris1:18:15 Yeah, they would. Yeah, they would.

Neil1:18:16 They'd be like, oh, yeah, well, it's not on, not on topic.

Chris1:18:19 Yeah, no, no, this is, I would say this is 85% not on top.

Neil1:18:24 I think this is the greatest podcast that's ever existed, isn't it? It's brilliant. Yeah, Just brilliant just the way it is. I, I, I, I just think that the world is in this. AI, I think, is really interesting. One of the things that I realized over the past couple of weeks, I've been doing a ton of stuff with AI and words like essentially where we can use it, what we can do with it, what makes sense for us and what doesn't, like at work. And one of the things that hit me over the past week is that AI in what if AI written stuff is always complete.

Chris1:19:14 Yes.

Neil1:19:14 Right.

Chris1:19:14 So, so okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil1:19:16 So if it has, let's, let's, let's assume that this is, let's assume that it's doing a podcast about this album. Yeah, it would have like seven or eight different themes.

Chris1:19:26 Yeah.

Neil1:19:27 It would talk about each one of them. Fully complete them, fully complete the thought process on those themes. Make sure they were all complete and make sure, you know, it would say, oh, well, you know, no one was interested initially. And then there was a video and, you know, and then they went on tour and then this happened and it would do a beautiful, beautifully, you know, correctly documented and described set of threads. But whenever you see a human, even a brilliant human writer, they have like these half finished thoughts. So they'll have a thought in the writing. Then they'll go on to something else and they'll never come back to that half finished bit. Or they'll go off on a tangent and tell you about, you know, a antivirus consultant that got stuck in a plastic tube and AI doesn't do that. No, it doesn't.

Chris1:20:25 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil1:20:26 It can't do that. It doesn't do that kind of, that, that human kind of brain fart thing that we do. And I'm at this point where like, if I'm analyzing data, I want my AI to do that. I wanted to kind of go and look at the data and I want it to tell me what's weird about it so I can go and have a poke around and figure out what I need to do from listening to a podcast or I'm watching some comedy or I'm watching something, you know, I'm watching a TV show. I don't want completed. I don't want everything to be perfectly, beautifully balanced, you know, in the same way that it's like, I don't want all my music to be perfectly clicked and perfectly in tune and perfect. You know, I mean, I don't want it to be perfect. I kind of want to hear something not quite right. And it kind of hit me that that AI, that's what it. It. Everything's just gray. It's all just like, like finished and complete. And I think as humans, I. I don't know, it's. It. I think there's going to be this big difference between, you know, this kind of AI generated stuff and the beautiful chaos that we do. It's. I mean, it's just not. Is it. It's like, do you know what I mean? It took me a long time to get it to do the code to force the AI to create the descriptions for the show because it doesn't like. It just wants to kind of. It just wants to round it off. It wants to make it all beautiful and neat and you know, I don't know, the faster we're falling, we're stopping stalling, we're running in circles again Just as things were looking up. You said it wasn't good enough but still we're trying one more time

Chris1:22:25 Maybe

Neil1:22:25 we're just trying too hard when really it's closer than it is too far. Cause I'm in too deep and I'm trying to keep up above in my head instead of going I. Cause I'm in too deep and I'm trying to keep up above in my head instead of going under instead of going under. Seems like each time I'm with you I lose my mind Because I'm bending over backwards to a mate it's one thing to complain but when you're driving me insane well then I think it's time that we took a break

Chris1:23:17 maybe

Neil1:23:17 we're just trying too hard when really it's closer than it is too far Cuz I'm in too deep and I'm trying to keep up above in my head instead of going, going under Cuz I'm in too deep and I try to keep up a in my head instead of going under Going under, going under. I can't sit back and wonder why it took so long for this to die I hate it when you fake it you can't hide it you might as well embrace it so believe me it's not easy Something's telling me I've been too deep and I'm trying to keep up a fall in my head instead of going under Cuz I'm in too deep and I try to keep up a fall in my head Instead of going under Instead of going under Instead of going under I can't again Instead of going under Instead of going under again Instead of going under again. I don't know how you guys feel but I mean for me it feels like, I mean we were working so much back then that a lot of it kind of just goes by. I mean I don't really remember it coming out. I know like, I don't really remember like the moment it was out. You know we were. I don't know if you guys do. What were we doing that we. I mean there's so much work that goes around. All that kind of stuff. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. We kind of came from like being signed in 1999, then going and kind of making our first album half hour Power and then. But being put on the road right away across America for like it seemed like forever and we were only you know, 19 and 20 years old and then like coming off of that half hour power tour and kind of going right into the studio to do do. I'll kill her. Yeah, it was just like it was a constant thing. We're still living at our parents house and like we never stopped.

Chris1:26:18 If you want to see probably one of the greatest creative minds and what, what the human mind is able to achieve, have a look at Bobby Fingers.

Neil1:26:27 Bobby Fingers. Every time I see Bobby Fingers I think about, I think about you saying Bingers. When we tried to do image when AI first started and we tried to do some and we. We, like, We. We realized we could make the AI make pictures, and we thought, oh, this would be really funny. What we'll do is we'll get it to make you imagine us in various scenarios or. Or we would say something on the show. And I think once I said something like, I was so angry, I kicked my wheelie bin over. And so we got the AI to do it, but it couldn't draw fingers.

Chris1:27:00 Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Neil1:27:01 So you remember it would. You'd have like eight fingers, two fingers or whatever. Ever. And then we were talking about it and laughing, and I think Lindsay was making fun of us.

Chris1:27:09 Yes. It's because the way I said Warhammer. Warhammer.

Neil1:27:16 Yeah. And. Yeah, and then you called it Bingers and it just killed me. It's just. How was that?

Chris1:27:24 Not a.

Neil1:27:25 Not a thing.

Chris1:27:26 Yeah.

Neil1:27:27 That should have been like a. That should have been like a worldwide thing. That should have been on the news.

Chris1:27:32 Yeah.

Neil1:27:33 People are going, oh, bingo is still a big problem in AI. You did. You can do fingers now.

Chris1:27:40 Yeah, it's fine, isn't it?

Neil1:27:42 If that was ever, I wouldn't. There must have been like a pre Bingers and post fingers moment.

Chris1:27:49 Yeah. Yeah. What we're doing.

Neil1:27:52 I think we're done.

Chris1:27:53 Oh, yeah. I don't think we need to do a song and then come back, do we?

Neil1:27:57 I don't know. Shall we? Yeah, yeah. Let me.

Chris1:28:00 Nickelback.

Neil1:28:02 Let me just. I just want to make sure. Because there's two Nickelback albums.

Chris1:28:08 Yeah.

Neil1:28:10 And, you know, it's Silver side Up.

Chris1:28:15 Is that the how you remind me one?

Neil1:28:17 Yeah. So they did. They did a curb in 96, the state in 99.

Chris1:28:22 Yeah.

Neil1:28:22 And then they did Silver side up in 2001. Now Silver side Up was the one that brought. That's the one that's got how you remind me of on it. But there was. I think it's the State. Okay. Cowboy hats on there. So the ones before, they're really good. And then it started to. A lot of. A lot about the long road's quite a good thing when they start to deteriorate a little bit, but the songwriting starts to get. Starts to change. And then they've got a new album called Everything under the sun, which is out on 30th of October, and it's a bit gentian. Do you know what I mean? Like modern. I don't want modern Nickelback. I want Silver side Up. Yeah, go and do that.

Chris1:29:04 Yeah.

Neil1:29:05 Mr. Nickelback. Another interesting thing, while I'm talking about Nickelback, Can I play something?

Chris1:29:12 Yeah.

Neil1:29:12 This is really good podcast. Does that not sound like Nickelback?

Chris1:29:25 It does got. It's definitely that vibe. Yeah.

Neil1:29:31 Probably gets cancelled. That's a dude called Jerus Johnson.

Chris1:29:34 Yeah.

Neil1:29:34 Brand spanking new.

Chris1:29:35 Really?

Neil1:29:36 Sounds like old school Nickelback.

Chris1:29:37 Yeah, it does.

Neil1:29:38 That's what I want.

Chris1:29:39 Yeah.

Neil1:29:39 Nickelback. Go and do that. It's funny though, because it's like that, like if I. It's like when you.

Chris1:29:46 Sounds like southern rock but they're Canadian, doesn't it? Yeah.

Neil1:29:49 I don't know where he's from, so Duke or Jerus Johnson he's got.

Chris1:29:53 But I mean, Nickelback in general has got a Southern, like that Southern style thing going on.

Neil1:29:57 That is very true. Yeah, that is very, very true. Yeah, he. I guess that 2001 thing, isn't it? It was that. That started American rock star was massive.

Chris1:30:10 Yeah. Everyone's cowboys and stuff.

Neil1:30:12 Yeah.

Chris1:30:12 Yeah.

Neil1:30:13 Which is cool. It was kind of the. The punk, the. The pump punk, pop punk. It was all like frat houses and. And spring break and whenever you saw them in videos, they were always in a swimming pool or.

Chris1:30:27 Yeah.

Neil1:30:27 At a party somewhere.

Chris1:30:29 Yeah.

Neil1:30:29 Do you know what I mean? And then. And then you had like Nickelback. There was always a house party.

Chris1:30:36 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Neil1:30:38 There's just that huge vibe going on through 2001 and 2 and 3 kind of things kind of just. Just this massive party vibe that was happening. It's. I don't know, it's funny because like you ended up with, you know, grunge was like the entire opposite of that in like the mid-90s.

Chris1:30:56 Yeah.

Neil1:30:58 But there was this. Just this massive. This. I'm sure there was other music that wasn't just that, but that's what it felt like to me. It just felt like all of these kind of massive party anthems in early 2000 still, you know, I suppose it feels like some of. Some of the music's gone back to that time as well, I guess. Pop punk is now big. We, we, we. I've got a folder in Apple Music that's called New New Stuff for the Radio.

Chris1:31:26 Yeah. Yeah.

Neil1:31:27 And as I hear it, I keep just tagging it in and. And sticking it in there. But there's tons of new, like brand spanking new unsigned pop punk bands literally singing about wishing it was like 1998. Yeah. I don't know.

Chris1:31:44 Yeah, yeah.

Neil1:31:45 Well, cool.

Chris1:31:46 Yeah.

Neil1:31:47 Sorry, sorry.

RIFF094 - Sum 41 - All Killer, No Filler

Show Notes

When a VHS Tape of Lads Messing About Sold a Record Deal

Episode Description

What You'll Hear:

Featured Tracks & Analysis:

Tangential Gold:

Why This Matters:

You can find us here:

Transcript

Comments