A Chris: Ah, you see, I've already did that once and it didn't record properly.
B Neil: It wasn't quite as good, was it?
A Chris: It wasn't quite as good that time.
B Neil: So you missed it.
A Chris: You missed the best Riffology at the beginning.
B Neil: I want to talk about your new shoes.
A Chris: You want to talk about what?
B Neil: Your new shoes. My very shoes. They're very shiny. They're nice.
A Chris: These are actually new old shoes. These were shoes that I brought.
B Neil: Oh, and left them in the box.
A Chris: Yeah, well, they were in the cupboard. I've got a lot. I've got. I've got a shoe problem.
B Neil: Do you?
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, no, I have actually. I've got. I've actually got a bit of a problem with it. Like. I have a lot of shoes.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: I don't wear hardly any of them, but I keep. I keep buying them, but I don't buy them new. I buy them like in sales or even like right marketplace secondhand.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Pick him up. And they all live in the cupboard.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: And I put some on and. And I'll put them on but I won't like them.
B Neil: Oh, so.
A Chris: But rather than doing something useful with them, like take them to the charity shop.
B Neil: Yeah. You leave them in your cupboard.
A Chris: They're just. They're all in the cupboard.
B Neil: Yeah, I'm at that point now. You. You've got two girls. Yeah, I've got two boys. My oldest boy.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Is the same. He's an 11 foot.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: So he just wears my shoes now, which is a bit weird.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: But I like, I see mine, I'm pointing at my Converse.
A Chris: Yeah, you got Good, good.
B Neil: Do you know what I do with them? They give them to put them in the washing machine.
A Chris: Oh, do you put them.
B Neil: Literally put them in the washing machine and they come out and they look new and I think, oh, where them again?
A Chris: Keep them then.
B Neil: Yeah, I don't. I don't.
A Chris: Do they wear down? Because I was. I walk a bit funny so the heels always go on mine.
B Neil: I'm showing, Chris. Showing.
A Chris: Got you obviously walk with. Proper gate.
B Neil: Walk with a gate. Yeah, I don't. I don't know. I don't know what I do. I don't walk much. No, I did I tell you I had. Oh, this is riffology, by the way. It's about music. We'll get there. We'll get.
A Chris: We'll get there any minute.
B Neil: We'll get there. I had to go and see a. Oh, God, my brain's gone blank. What are those people that, you know? Physiotherapist yes. Blurted that out. Frogs say. I had to go and see a physiotherapist because my shoulder was really painful and I was doing loads, A lot of pain in my back and my shoulder. Loads and loads of pain.
A Chris: I remember that.
B Neil: And I was. And I've been, I've been. I didn't do it.
A Chris: Didn't you fold? What happened? You did something.
B Neil: Oh, I've done all kinds of things over the years. I've done you crash cars, fallen downstairs. But anyway, I've been running and doing a bit of. A bit of exercise and stuff. Not like crazy stuff. Right. But you know, like couch to 5K where you do more walking than.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Anyway, I. I go and go and see her and she said, first of all, it's not your back or your shoulder, it's your neck.
A Chris: Right, okay.
B Neil: And I go, well, that sounds good.
A Chris: That's your spine in it. That's. That's important.
B Neil: She says it's the connection.
A Chris: Brain, she says.
B Neil: She says you, you know, she said you're an old man now, which annoyed me as well. Basically you're saying you, you.
A Chris: You're an old man.
B Neil: But she said you don't move enough. Oh, right. That's what it was.
A Chris: Right.
B Neil: Because you don't move enough.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And that's what I have. You know, I do catch. I do catch to 5K.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And she's like, what's that, 20 minutes? Dismissive. Because you can't out. Like you can't sit on your ass for 12 hours.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And do a 20 minute.
A Chris: But we do a lot of sitting on our ass now, don't we? That's the problem.
B Neil: Anyway, that's what she said. So she said, move. Well, she said, take ibuprofen and move
A Chris: around a bit more. Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: So I'm trying to, I don't know, drugs and movement. I don't like it very much moving about. I find I'm much better at sitting down.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I feel better when. I do feel better when I move around.
A Chris: Yeah. No, I think that's why. Because I've been a bit. Bit weird last few days. Like, you know. You know like when you go a bit funny because you're not doing a lot.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: And then I went for a walk and it's. Everything's fine, actually.
B Neil: You feel it's better, don't you? Yeah, I feel guilty when I'm not at my desk.
A Chris: Yeah, that's the problem.
B Neil: And it's bizarre. Most like I.
A Chris: Or, you know, you're not connected to your email.
B Neil: And it's not like I'm a data entry person or something. I don't like, you know, like most of the value I bring to the world is in thinking. Usually bashing my keyboard's not that valuable all the time, so. But anyway, this is Riffology. We don't just talk about physiotherapy.
A Chris: You need to finish talking about the shoes first.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: So. Because these were in the cupboard for a long time.
B Neil: I will say they're black. It's a lovely black and red Adidas with red. And we've got silver flashes on them. They're very.
A Chris: They're nice. Apparently they're for running. I'm not done any running.
B Neil: Are they?
A Chris: But the problem was, was I think I did. I did buy them and did a run in them.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: But they were. I thought I tied them too tight.
B Neil: Oh.
A Chris: So they hurt my feet.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: I got back, my feet were really hurting.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: And I thought, like I put in the cup and I thought, well, you.
B Neil: Shoes.
A Chris: So I bought some different shoes. Which also went in the cupboard.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: But I got these out and so I wonder what would happen if I just loosen the laces a bit and they're actually really comfortable.
B Neil: I really like that. Do you want to show you my secret?
A Chris: What's the secret?
B Neil: Look. I haven't got laces. They're elastic. Wow.
A Chris: Well, you fooled me. But then you haven't got. You see, I've got tying on them. Have you? You haven't got a bow tie.
B Neil: Swanging my laces for Chris. But they're. They're. And God, this podcast, really weird. Has just gone down a weird start. There was somebody apple music going. This is not music. My youngest. I can't. I. Shoelaces. Yeah. He's too lazy because he's a boy and boy, like teenage boys are dead lazy.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: And he's like. So what he used to do was he just used to ram his feet into his shoes and he would, you
A Chris: know, shove the laces down the side.
B Neil: Oh, just would it. No, he would leave them tied.
A Chris: All right.
B Neil: And then the shoes would get like damaged.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: So I was dispatched to solve this and bought some elastic laces for him. Which he loved.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And I was so jealous you put them on yours. I bought myself a Pep.
A Chris: That's how it worked then.
B Neil: I've not confessed to another grown up that I've got elastic laces.
A Chris: Is that like next up from Velcro? Is that. Is that.
B Neil: I don't know. But no. One ever notices.
A Chris: Oh.
B Neil: And genuinely, I can, I can literally, I could walk home tonight.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Take these off, chuck them in the washing machine. They would come out like spotless. Really, really super clean. Like almost look new.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And I stick them in the airing cupboard overnight and I woke up in the morning, I stick them on.
A Chris: And then you've got fresh smelling feet as well.
B Neil: Yeah. And because they're like elastic laces and that, I don't have to tie any shoelaces.
A Chris: Where's the end of it?
B Neil: There isn't one. They're literally like, it's like. Imagine there's like a little T piece there and a T piece. Then you just poke them through. Oh, so they're like single. They're like single. Each one is singular.
A Chris: And then it just stretches with your foot.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Why have you got laces when you can do that?
B Neil: I don't know. They just take good. I don't know. I don't know. It's the only pair of shoes I've got with elastic laces. I've only got like two pairs of shoes, to be fair. But so you.
A Chris: Wow, that's really good. I've got. I can't. I've got an embarrassing amount of shoes.
B Neil: Right. This is Riffology.
A Chris: 7 minutes podcast about music. 7 minutes.
B Neil: Not physiotherapy or laces or shoes.
A Chris: I'm Chris.
B Neil: I'm Neil.
A Chris: And we've been doing this for a while now. There's lots of you that follow us, which is lovely. God knows why.
B Neil: Do you know, in the last 12 months we are going to hit 20,000 downloads.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: That's amazing, isn't it?
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Thank you.
A Chris: Yeah, thank you very much.
B Neil: 20,000 of you.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Which is a lot.
A Chris: That's a lot. There was a time where, because when we first did it, we thought, oh, if we get like, you know, 10 people a week, that'd be quite nice.
B Neil: It was about 10 people and we knew all 10 as well. When you first started with doing. If you are doing a podcast and you and you want to do this, what I would say is it's a bit of a grind sometimes. Well, if you're famous, it's not a grind. Sometimes you get famous people and they just like vomit a podcast out and then they've got like, you know what I mean? They're like top of the charts.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: But if you're at home and, and you, you feel like, you know what? I really like frogs. And you want to do a podcast about frogs, just do it.
A Chris: Yeah, do it.
B Neil: And don't look at how many people. No, just do it. Just do it and have a really bloody good time doing it.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: And then in like three years after you've started it, y.
A Chris: You'll have thousands.
B Neil: Then go and have a look and see. But don't. Yeah, don't. Don't look at how. Because I used to be not disappointing. But you would go. You would. You would.
A Chris: Like, why are there not more people listen to us talk about shoes.
B Neil: Pull your heart out into. Into something and you do. I remember spending. Spending like weeks over research for albums and stuff.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And no one would just think, not doing it again. Don't like you. Yeah. Just do it. Yeah, I, I totally. What? I watch all kinds of crap. I love. I'd listen to a podcast about frogs.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Do you actually podcast? I would. You know what? I would. Really? Would you have you do.
A Chris: Do you or would you. Is that what you said?
B Neil: I would.
A Chris: You would.
B Neil: I totally would.
A Chris: What's your favorite frog?
B Neil: I don't know.
A Chris: I don't know many frogs.
B Neil: I know normally I like the ones
A Chris: that are like neon colors.
B Neil: My. Well, Liz's mom's got a pond and that's got frogs in it. And I quite like going and looking to see what they're doing.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: I don't. I don't know much about them.
A Chris: Yeah. But I like looking at frog spawn.
B Neil: Yep. They do spawn.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then that, that. Do you know, things I don't like? They have billions of spawn.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then there are only like three frogs. But the number of frogs doesn't seem to increase. Yeah. Like you, like, she'll be really proud and go, oh, look, my frogs have done spawn. And there's like 1 million pieces of frogs.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Frog spawn. And then there's like. Like 1 million tadpoles.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then you go down one day,
A Chris: nature, and they're all gone. You fish.
B Neil: There's no fish in a pond, though.
A Chris: Yeah, but they just come. They come. That's why you're flying fish.
B Neil: They put their shoes on.
A Chris: So the fish fly in the pond.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Have the tadpoles and fly out again. That's why they're called flying fishes.
B Neil: Right. Well, I'm glad we sorted that out. But yeah, I, I nature, which I like. I like weird and wacky stuff. So do a podcast on it. I like things about welding. I like things.
A Chris: In all honesty, though, if you know what happens in the tadpoles, tell us because that'll. We'll be talk. That'll bother us both for a week.
B Neil: I reckon there'll be a room somewhere with tadpoles and, like, odd socks. You reckon? And, yeah, all the copies of the first five Goo Goo Dolls album that I reckon one person has brought me in the world and he's like this steadily. Do you know what? I'm gonna go off on a rant.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: You know, I. I like those first handful of Goo Goo Dolls albums. There's a few that I really like and I really never ment. I know, I know. The other one's bush 16 stone.
A Chris: Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it's so expensive.
B Neil: Yeah. But they're always the same bloody price. So when they come up on discogs, they're either 330 Canadian dollars or €150.
A Chris: Right, okay. Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Who decides that?
A Chris: Who, like, sets the global price of final exchange rate?
B Neil: Dickens. Anyway, we're doing Train Stupid Stupider.
A Chris: Before we go into the real thing.
B Neil: Shall we just. Should we go on a tangen?
A Chris: 11 minutes in now, this is why it's an hour and a half that our podcast lasts, because we just. This happens. Not always, but that's what I was going to say is that we've cracked the code of the podcast.
B Neil: Have we?
A Chris: We've cracked the podcast code in that, actually, we do the thing about the albums, which is always informative. We also do like the Bongo Cokes.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Where we hide our Cokes under the bongos.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Which we haven't got any tonight, so
B Neil: we had to go buy them. Yeah.
A Chris: And then Lindsay's black and red fruit pastels didn't spot if they got any in the asda, I spotted. Oh, they've got some. Yeah, yeah. And. And also we talk about frogs and shoes and physiotherapy and I think, actually that's why people keep coming back.
B Neil: Is that what it is?
A Chris: Yeah, I think so.
B Neil: I know. I reckon half of our listeners have gone. Now we're talking about shoes and physiotherapy again. It used to be. I remember Lindsay making fun of us saying that every podcast we said, oh, we don't feel very well. Remember that? Yeah, Remember? She did, she did, she did. Buzzword bingo.
A Chris: And how. I don't know, I say Warhammer.
B Neil: Yeah. War War Rubber. Oh, brilliant. I liked. I said to someone the other day, I haven't got an accent. And they're like, yes, you have.
A Chris: Yeah. Right. Train drops. Jupiter.
B Neil: Yeah, Done.
A Chris: Yeah, that's it.
B Neil: Can I just say this out this album, we. We did this because Last week we did the matchbox 20.
A Chris: Yes.
B Neil: Yourself or someone like you. Both of these albums, this one, Train Drops of Jupiter and Matchbox 20. Yourself or someone like you both came to me via girlfriends. They really knew albums that I would have, like. I would never have bought this. Like, not a hope in hell.
A Chris: I would have.
B Neil: You know, I was like Megadeth and Slayer. And this time 2001 would have been new metal. It would have been Linkin Park. It would have been System of A Down. It would have been. That's why I would have been. Been listening to.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And both of them came to me via the girls.
A Chris: Right. That was with There they are girl albums, aren't they?
B Neil: You know. You know, when girls, like, come with
A Chris: the tapes, I'm gonna get told off for that. That's quite sexist, isn't it? But they are, though.
B Neil: They're quite. You just keep going. This is good.
A Chris: If they're gonna be albums that are recommended to you by a girl, it'd be like Lance Morissette and. I love the album. I love them.
B Neil: Them. Yeah.
A Chris: But that. But that's a very feminine.
B Neil: Was a girl album as well. I quite like all of them, but they're albums that I wouldn't have. But they're a bit like, you know, we did Jeff Buckley's Grace.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: That's an album I would never, ever have done. But you. Not that you're a girl, but you recommended that and you know what I mean? And they're funny. These albums are where. Where you have, like, a perception of them and like this trainer. Funny to me. Matchbox 20, to a degree.
A Chris: Oh, there's a nice Jeff Buckley link as well, isn't there, with this?
B Neil: Yeah, there is, but so. So this album, to me, it's. It's like, too rocky to be pop.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: It's too poppy to be, like, really rocky. Like, it's not. It's like. I mean, I know that kind of, like, post grunge wave had kind of run out at this point. The kind of REM and, you know, it kind of run its course a little bit. But you had. You did have matchbox 20 in the charts at this point in time doing some big stuff. And you had Counting Crows and stuff, so it was like a big, big scene, I guess. But train, like, never. They didn't fit in with the rock guys.
A Chris: No.
B Neil: They didn't fit in with the pop guys. They were kind of in this. In between.
A Chris: They definitely fit in with the pop guys. But later when they did, like, hey, Soul Sister and those kind of bangers. Like.
B Neil: Well, similar. That's. For me, that's similar to Google. And we talked about. Yeah, yeah, we did A Boy Named Goo, which is one of my favorite records on the planet ever. Like, if it was. If things were on fire in the house, that's what you get, you know, the things that you would come and get. Yeah, yeah, that will be there.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I'd have it under my arm, probably. Yeah. But again, that for me, like back then, for those albums that was. They were rocky albums. They were punky and rocky. And then by the time they kind of nudged down towards, I don't know, like boxes and stuff, probably the stuff after Dizzy up the girl, right, they became like pop. More poppy. So like they, they, they found their people. Right. But. But they, they were a pop band so they, they became, you know, if you like pop music that you. You could like them.
A Chris: Right.
B Neil: Whereas probably previously you wouldn't have done. They're a bit Rocky train here for me. They're like in this middle ground. They're not. Which is interesting because it's like in one way gives you like a broader reach, potentially. Yeah, you kind of reach over into both, but it means that you're not really part of either, you know. And I think this is funny on this album, to me, there are bits that are kind of a little bit rocky and you think, oh, like respect is quite rocky. Interestingly. Respect, while we're talking about this and we'll come and do the facts later. And I may choose to think I'm not looking at my notes while I'm doing this. I think that Respect was actually released before the album. Yeah, it was on a Dawson's Creek.
A Chris: Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Reasons I don't know I treated you so cold Wish I had those times again. Something that you say keeps ringing in my. Someday you're going to want to come back, you're going to want to treat me fine. Everybody needs a little respect Everybody needs a little time Everybody needs a little respect Everybody needs a little. Watched me push you down in dreams I had of you and all I remember about those days I would run around thinking that you'd be all right but you lost your light along the way and oh, you were right about the things I say. Cuz if I had it back again I know I would. You know I treat you kind. Everybody needs a little respect. Everybody needs a little time. Everybody, everybody needs a little respect. Everybody needs a little time. Everybody got to have somebody. Everybody got to have someone All I. Want to talk to you Knock it down Seems you get the things you give along the way now all I need is one more chance don't make me feel like hanging around. Everybody needs a new Everybody needs a move Everybody needs a little respect Everybody needs a little time Everybody needs a little respect Everybody needs a little time Time Everybody Everybod.
A Chris: That was a good album.
B Neil: That was Dawson's Creek.
A Chris: Yeah. The soundtrack volume.
B Neil: Yeah. Soundtrack volume one and volume two. This was on. Respect was on volume two, was it?
A Chris: Right. The one. The one that's got Chantelle. Can't pronounce the surname. Sorry. But it's a cover of Leaving on a Jet Plane. Yeah. That's another quite sort of feminine album. Yeah. You know, they.
B Neil: The girls, they're doing really well with this.
A Chris: That Leaving on a Jet Plane song is an absolute banger. It's so. It's so beautiful. She did such a good job of it.
B Neil: And if you're a girl and you'd like to write interest. Sorry.
A Chris: Really?
B Neil: So. Oh, did you know another. Do you know what's weird about this? I. I really want to do Ugly Kid Joe America. That's a girl's album as well.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Isn't it? I mean, tell me. I mean, tell me I'm wrong. I'm wrong.
A Chris: I don't know. I'm sure there'll be plenty of people skills album.
B Neil: It is like girls. All the girls knew all of that and knew it all.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And some boys, too. But mostly. Mostly girls really loved it. I think it's such a good record.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: If you've not listene. We. I totally want to do this next week. If you've not listened to.
A Chris: We decided that already.
B Neil: America's Least wanted yet. Go and do it. Stop now and go and listen. Because dead good. It's far more like guitar rip Rory solo with a new. Remember it?
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Deckard. But yeah, definitely that's a girl's album. But there are other albums that are not girls albums.
A Chris: No. Master Puppets.
B Neil: Yeah. That's not one.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I was gonna say System of a Down, but actually.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: I don't know. Yeah, I think that might be like. Like, I. I think I see more girls with System of a Down.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Than boys.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Where did Nirvana say? Because. Yeah.
B Neil: Do you know my kid. My kids. We talked about this before. My kids are all into Nirvana at the minute.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Barnaby wants to be a famous video creator, right. YouTuber. And he's doing really well. His videos have had, like, Tens and twenties of thousands.
A Chris: Really.
B Neil: Yeah, it's doing really well. But he puts Nirvana music on them.
A Chris: Oh, right, okay. Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And he comes into. Dad, is this one cool, Son? They're all cool.
A Chris: Where do we find said videos on Yo Cho.
B Neil: You wouldn't like them. That's not for me. I'm just thinking about the Venn diagram. Our listeners, Barnaby's listeners. I don't think two different groups of people. I think it's like one person. That's me. I think, I think I sit in, in the middle. They're nuts. Like he did a video of a blade of grass and then put on a Scottish accent and went oh, blade of grass. Like 20,000 like 11 year olds like that.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah. All saying at school that kind of thing.
B Neil: Don't get it. I really don't get it. But yeah, yeah. Less said about that the better.
A Chris: I like this album a lot because I know this one, you know, because I. When Drops of Jupiter came out.
B Neil: Yeah. 27th of March 2001.
A Chris: There we go. It absolutely hit me like a. Oh, that single just. Oh yeah, sorry, yeah. The single itself, like the thing about that song, like blew my mind a bit. I thought this is such a brilliant pop song. You know, like when it came, it comes in obviously led by the piano and then you know, just a absolute killer top line right from the beginning, just you know, to die for and all that sort of stuff. But it. What. But it was the last one to be written, it wasn't it? It was like. If I remember rightly, the, the. The. The label like needed a pop song. They got this album, they got a load of tracks that were ready to go but. But they needed to write a pop song and they didn't have one. And like there's such a great story behind this about his, him. His mum visited him in a dream and you know, kind of giving. Giving him a line and then he woke up and then this, this kind of song poured out of him cuz his mum had recently died.
B Neil: Nuts, isn't it? Like Pat Monahan took the album to the record company and we're basically the record company went, there's no singles here.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And it's funny that like the band were like we, we thought we'd got. You know, it's a bit like someone telling you children are ugly. You know, it's like.
A Chris: Because there's some brilliant songs on it,
B Neil: we, we were really pleased with it. You know, we thought it was one of the best things that we'd done we were really pleased, you know. And the record label, like, there's no single, there's no lead single here. You need to figure that out. And it's funny listening to Pat talk about this time in the band, just how much he was suffering that the relentless touring. They were. They were. They released their first record.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Which they initially released self funded, I think. There was no record label. They released it, then the label kind of picked them up. But they were passed on by a couple of labels at that point in time. So they're out there touring. They were out with Bare Naked Ladies and. And Counting Crows and. Yeah, they did a whole bunch of. They were relentlessly touring.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: His marriage was breaking down, his mum had died. Constantly touring and then took the record and a record label went, no, it's not very good. It was about 2000 and we were making our second record. We were struggling trying to find what our record label and manager at the time thought was a hit also. It was a hard time for me to be inspired because my mother had passed away just recently. And Columbia Records, a guy called Donny Einer, who was running things, he basically was calling a meeting for me. I had to go to New York in three days to meet with him. So I went to sleep that night and woke up and I had every single word and every melody done. The next day a friend of mine helped me demo it. The next day I flew to New York. And I didn't think it was something that anyone would care about at the time. Donnie started to talk to me about, hey, you know, this is what's gonna happen. We need a hit, you know, have that on this record. You know, here's why I think that. And I was really disappointed, but I had a CD in my pocket and I was like, what do you think? So he played it and he shut his eyes and he was listening to it. He just went, whoa. Song of the Year. We went from no hits to possibly having a special one. So I feel like my mom wrote that song and sent it to me and it's been 20 years, so where's the next one, Mom? You know what I mean? I'm thinking, like, I need drops of Jupiter part, too. Let's go. Now that she's back in the atmosphere Droughts of Jupiter in her head. She acts now like summer and walks like rain Reminds me that there's a time to change. Since the return of a stay on the moon she listens like spring and she talks like June. But tell me, did you sail across the sea, sun did you make it to the Milky Way to see the lights all faded and that heaven is overrated Tell me, did you fall from a shooting star One without a permanent scar and then you missed me While you were looking for yourself out there. Now that she's back from that soul vacation Tracing away through the constellation. She checks out most of what she does Chapel reminds me that there's room to grow yeah, yeah now there she's back in the atmosphere I'm afraid that she might think of me as plain old change oh, sorry. About a man who was too afraid to fly so we never did land but tell me did the wind sweep you off your feet did you finally get the chance to dance along the lot of days Head back to the Milky Way and tell me to Venus blow your mind Wasn't everything you wanted to find and then you missed me While you were looking for yourself out there. Can you imagine no love fried deep fried chicken your best friend always sticking up for you Even when I know you're wrong can you imagine your first dance Freeze. Drive. Romance Five out. Phone conversation the best so I'll say that you ever had in me but tell me did the wind sweep you off your feet did you finally get the chance to dance along the line of day and head back to the Milky Way and tell me did you sail across the sound did you make it to the Milky Way your way to see the lights are fading and that heaven is overrated Tell me, did you fall for a shooting star Warm without a permanent scar and then you miss me While you were looking for yourself now, now, now, now, now, now, now, now, now, now, now finally get the ch. And then you're only looking for your. Did you miss me While you were looking for yourself? Up there is kind of, I think, the. The line that connects the most. But there were several lyrics that people wanted me to change or remove. And they are. Soy latte, fried chicken. And what was the other one? There was a third one. But I was like, okay, yeah, I'll change them. And then I didn't. But the pressure that he must have been under at that point, you know, was just. Just. I mean, it's really difficult, isn't it? Like, I know.
A Chris: Well, because it's your art. Because it's. It's your. It's the. It's the expression of yourself through your creative. And someone else, you know, by. By. It is just how it is, you know. That would be an act of someone saying, well, you're not valid. Your work, your Work is invalid.
B Neil: It's like someone just shouting at you, like, be creative. Yeah, yeah, yeah, just be creative now. And you know, if it's there, like, you know, we, we. We heard when we did the Oasis Records, you know, back in the Definitely maybe and watch the Story era. Noel saying that songs were just like literally just fell out of him. So he walked into this crappy room in the middle of nowhere and he just couldn't sit down with a guitar and not write a great song. It just, it just. They just poured out. But the opposite is true. Right? If you're. If it's not, you're not in the right, right place. Yeah, the opposite is true. And then, you know, this, this song. I'd love to hear the demos of this and I, I did search and couldn't find the demos of Drops of Jupiter. But the, the thing I think is interesting is the, the record label heard it and then immediately kind of sent in a bunch of people to go and make it great.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: You know, and they were like, this is a, this is a Grammy. Which it did go on to. Yeah, yeah, a Grammy. But. But I'd love to have heard that original.
A Chris: The demo.
B Neil: Where did it come from? You know, what, what. What actually did that sound like? Cuz then. Cuz they then added a whole bu. Like they added strings really.
A Chris: Like the strings and piano are really dominant actually. I think it's really saying they're quite a guitar band.
B Neil: The strings.
A Chris: The strings and the piano like drive that song really.
B Neil: Yeah, it. It's great drummer.
A Chris: I have to say that. Like the rhythm section of the band. I mean they're all great players but in particular, like throughout the album. Album. The, the. The. The drum. The drums are absolutely in the pocket for the, for the entire record. And then the last. I would say three or four songs, maybe three songs on the record, like this bass suddenly comes alive, you know, and then.
B Neil: And then the bass lines.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, incredible.
B Neil: Incredible bass space in there. Brendan o' Brien produced it in the end and yeah, there's. It's a lovely delicacy to it, I think, which is quite common of the record that these kind of ad. Adult rock records of. Of the time where they're they managed to like be smooth without being like uber produced. Yeah, it's like. There's like a looseness to it where, you know, there's like.
A Chris: This is what the phrase you use on the blog. This like Southern. This Southern sort of looseness.
B Neil: Yeah, it's kind of. It's quite chill. It's Relaxed, isn't it? You kind of get the feeling that nobody's like obsessing over like beat counts and stuff and it's kind of song will find it.
A Chris: That's right.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: It feels right a lot.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: The songs really feel right, I think.
B Neil: I think so. But yeah, but yeah, Brendan o' Brien did the production. I think he's. I mean he was renowned for doing.
A Chris: He did big rock stuff, didn't he?
B Neil: Stuff. Yeah, it's a. It's an interesting record for him to. To do, I think.
A Chris: But he's a great rock producer.
B Neil: Came alive. Yeah.
A Chris: I. I always remember loving literally because he did. Because he. He didn't do Tess 10 but he did a couple of the other Pearl Jam earlier records. I think he did Vitalogy and Versus did verses.
B Neil: Yeah. Let me look in my list. He did Vitalogy and Versus. Let me get. Should I give you a quick look? Yeah, let's go through and give you a quick list of service did that. I. Some of these I knew and some I didn't know. He did Black Crow, Shake Your Money Maker, 1990. Temple of the Dog. He did Red Hot Chili Peppers, Blood Sugar, Sex Magic. He did that? Yeah, he did. These are engine. These are engineering credits.
A Chris: Yes.
B Neil: We've talked about these before. Where engineering on these. And then you've got.
A Chris: We should do a Chili's one, you
B Neil: know we should do. Yeah, he'd have to Blood Sugar, Sex and Magic. Sure.
A Chris: Yeah. Or ornication.
B Neil: Fornication. Yeah. I struggle with Red Hot Chili Peppers.
A Chris: Yeah. I've got like a three song limit a little bit.
B Neil: I like. I quite like. I do like that.
A Chris: Yeah, no, I like that.
B Neil: I do find them hard work for a long. Listen. Stone Temple Pilots, he did. Corey was producer on that one. King's X, Dogman, Pearl Jam, Vitalogy, Sound God and Super Unknown. Stone Temple Pilots. Yeah. He did Neil Young's Mirror Ball. He did Pearl Jam. No Code Stem. Stone Temple Pilots, Tiny Music Songs from the Vatican Gift Shop. Rage against the Machine, Evil Empire, pearl jam yield. In 98 corn followed the leader Raging against the Machine, Battle of Los Angeles.
A Chris: And that was where he found his. That was his thing.
B Neil: Yeah. They went into New Limp Biscuit, Significant other. He did Stone temple pilots number four. Corns issues some of the greatest records
A Chris: of the 90s, aren't they just. Just. But the bit that got me was when he remixed 10.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Like he did. He did a.
B Neil: He. So you know the redu.
A Chris: Yeah, a bit further on he. He kind of revisited 10 that p. Late.
B Neil: I Wasn't.
A Chris: No, I think it was in the TW. It might have been in the 2000 and tens.
B Neil: That is quite. I think that is quite late 2010.
A Chris: But he's. But he did a stunning job of that because I always thought it was quite. It was really well produced and mixed, but it was quite chorusy and reverb and swimming. Because that was quite. That was quite, you know, like what. The fashion for the sort of mixing and the vibe at the time. Lots of chorus on things and stuff. And I think he kind of dried it all out.
B Neil: Out.
A Chris: It was a very direct, like, rock sound that he did and I'm. I really preferred it. I thought it really made the songs come out a lot more. But, you know, that's. That's my preference, I suppose. I do like the old. The old rock thing you do.
B Neil: I tell you what he did really well. I think he defined the sound of new metal.
A Chris: Yes.
B Neil: I think we should dive head in, let's do. And then let's go new. Let's go and dive into the. We've not done. And the thing is, we're at that point.
A Chris: Did we go corn? Do we do a corn?
B Neil: Yeah, we've done corn. We've not done Limp Biscuit.
A Chris: No.
B Neil: There's a bunch of, like, Linkin park stuff we could do around that time and. Yeah, and there's tons of stuff around that time that we could do that. That now we can do 2001.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: New metals starting system of a down as well, I suppose. I think they're in that at that time, which is good.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: But, yeah, anyway, Brendan o', Brien, I think. Yeah, he's pretty good, isn't he? And. And yeah, I think gave this album Room to Breathe, which I think it needed. It's got that.
A Chris: Because they're a San Francisco band, aren't they? Yeah, And I think they. They recorded this in Georgia.
B Neil: Yeah, that's it.
A Chris: Yeah. In Atlanta. Yeah.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Is that club. So I'm not very good at American geography. Is that quite close? And then it was mastered. Bob Ludwig mastered it in.
B Neil: Yes.
A Chris: Portland.
B Neil: Oh, is it? I thought it was a New York Ludwig. Yeah, you might be right. I can't tell. It'll be in my. It'll be in my notes down here. But, yeah, that's what he says on your.
A Chris: On your WhatsApp.
B Neil: Yeah, Ludwig did them. He. He mastered everything.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
B Neil: I think. I think he was just like. I don't know he ever slept. Bob Ludwig. At that point in time, he was just like Mastering stuff. But yeah, it's got a lovely sound to it. They'd released. They redid the master of it I think in one of the anniversary year, like 2011, 2021, something like that.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Oh no, actually it'd be on my list. Is that on my list of. I'm going to scroll down to the bottom of the blog and put my glasses on because there was a bit where it got reissued. Oh, I can't see it. I'll find it in a bit. But it got reissued on sacd, our super audio cd.
A Chris: I totally forgot about that.
B Neil: Not much got redone on sacd. It was a. Was it a Sony thing?
A Chris: It was, yeah.
B Neil: They. They'd like this high res ma. It was taken from the original studio tapes.
A Chris: It was 24. Was it 24 bit 48 kilohertz or something like that?
B Neil: It might have been even higher. Yeah. A lot of them were 24. Like one 190. Oh really? Wow. A lot of them were quite high
A Chris: because were there on dvd it was like dv. It was like a DVD format, wasn't it?
B Neil: I think so, yeah. SACD is a weird format, isn't it? It's like it. Like normal CD player won't play it. Yeah, no, you need a special player to. To play it and in most cases you can't tell the difference. We being really genuinely. I think. I think the reason things like this one work and they're quite cool is because they were. They were taken from the original tapes again. So they were. Somebody spent a bit of time. They were remastered as well, I think. So they, they, they. They did sound a little bit better. But. Yeah, but yeah, it's. It's funny. I think the. The albums that get that treatment.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: You know which ones work. This is one I would never have expected.
A Chris: No, that's very true.
B Neil: To get that trip. But it is worth it. It's a good. It's a. It's a really nice sounding record.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I think it's aged really well as well. We spoke about Matchbox 20 last week.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Another one that I think has aged really well. I think it's these kind of vocal first. You know they're kind of.
A Chris: Yeah. Like top line heavy, aren't they there? Yeah, he's a great top line writer. The guy from Pat Monaghan is.
B Neil: Yeah, yeah.
A Chris: Great top line writer. Really, really good.
B Neil: And I think you know the, the production does it like helped it. I mean it definitely sounds of its era.
A Chris: Yes. Yeah.
B Neil: But. But I think part of that is kind of there's like a resurgence in like, 70s.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Stuff around this. I remember being. There was like a resurgence in 70s stuff around this time. You had that movie. Is it Almost Famous?
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Which is about the 70s.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Oh, this was in that.
A Chris: Ye.
B Neil: Was, was, was in that movie as well, which I think gave it a bit of a kick. But yeah, there was definitely something going on here where it was kind of production of rock was. I've kind of almost gone back a little bit to that kind of, you know, hazy.
A Chris: Wonderful.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: I thought it was really wonderful that it got just the right amount of compression, just the right amount of dynamic range. Everything kind of seemed to breathe everything your face off.
B Neil: Does it?
A Chris: Yeah. After this it got everything got a bit slammed again.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: I think, well, this were the loudness wars, I suppose. Was it? When that.
B Neil: Well, I think we got into that late 90s.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Where everything just got louder and louder and louder.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And I don't know, I think by the time we got here, you got. There was, there were bands that were pushing back. There was like Slip. Not famously recorded in analog.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: In this time frame. So there's a bunch of bands that were like that, I think that were just kind of, you know, pushing back on the, you know, the compression and winding everything up.
A Chris: But just to say I've spent some time over sort of last weekend with Mark Gardner from Ride. I don't know those guys from the 90s. And he's got a beautiful studio with lots of analog outboard gear. Because obviously I'm quite in the box if I do things. It's all.
B Neil: Yeah, yeah.
A Chris: Plugins in the software and that sort of thing, you know. He's obviously invested really heavily in his. In this really beautiful studio in Oxford. Oxford. And he's got this beautiful, like SSL console, you know, really, really beautiful, manly. It's got great studio smell. But the point I'm making is that you can tell really like you can, you, like you can. There's something about when you play with things analog in real life, you know, and send it properly through the circuits, you know, the plugins are really good. Yeah, they are really good. But there's just something else about the analog. There is something else.
B Neil: Do you know a lot of it? I, I, I'm not convinced. Is, is like physics.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I think there's like, like for me records, like we were talking, like, it
A Chris: might be, it might be about tactile.
B Neil: It might be about, you know, I think it's, it's weird. I Think we know when. When we. We used to listen to hi Fi, you know, audio. Esoteric audio gear a lot of the time. And I used to spend a huge amount of time in recording studios with, you know, microphones and recording and doing maths and stuff. And it's funny, you're like, in the. In like a set of loudspeakers will sound different in the morning than in the evening.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And there's no difference. I mean, this is. This is in, like, you know, in the bowels of. Of. Of treated rooms away from anywhere, you know, but. But like, you perceive that there's a difference and there's. You know, I've seen engineers chasing changes and. And measuring temperature of capacitors and. And power stuff because they're convinced that something's not right.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: You know, we. I think music. I think art in general, but we like that. The art obviously doesn't change, but our perception of it absolutely does. Yeah, there are. I mean, we've talked about this before, that Jeff Buckley album Grace. Yeah. I couldn't get on without. We were going to cover that and. And I really struggle. I really struggled. Struggled to. To just connect to that record.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then it was just one day. Just kind of just made sense.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah. You were headphones with that, weren't you?
B Neil: Yeah, but I think I had to be in the right frame of mind and. Had to be. And now I think it's, you know, it's gorgeous. It's a phenomenal record. But it's like. I think our perception of music isn't.
A Chris: It's not linear.
B Neil: We're not computers. It's not, you know, you don't, like, copy and paste the music and dump it, and then it sounds. Sounds like it sounds. I think this is why people. People like Rick Rubin have been successful. I mean, Rick Rubin's not got a clue what he's doing. Doesn't know anything about acoustics, doesn't know anything about music, doesn't know anything about, you know, how to play an instrument. But he knows what he likes and it knows how it makes him feel. And it's almost like he's, like he's. He's confident in his taste.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: To. To kind of guide and develop. And I think I was easy to miss that. I think it really is easy. Like, there are times that I'll go and pick an album, like albums that I really like.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And I turn it off. It kind of leaves me a bit cold. And I just think that's not, you know, what I mean, and. And it's. It's. I just need another album. I need another record to listen to at that point in time. And often I'll put on, like. I'll put on a record in the morning. I'll get to my desk in the morning, put a record on that, I think. Oh yeah, I quite fancy that. And it doesn't do it for me.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then I want to try something else and then eventually something will resonate with me and then I'll probably come back to that album in. In the first instance, say. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I think music's. I. I don't. I was saying that I. I think it is unlike an art in general thing. There. There are. You know, our perception of it changes.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: Depending on how we. How we feel. Which, like production. For. For production. It. How hard is that? You know what I mean? When your job is to make the thing sound great. When. When your perception of it, like, you know, I mean, you. You'll know this as well. Anyone that's worked on. On music, the first time you hear something versus the thousandth time you've heard it after you've gone over and over and over and over. They're really different.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah. TR.
B Neil: Since then I never feel helpless Recess this mess if you do and I found that even time well spent get spent if you need it to we do. Well, by now I've showed you how much I believe in the here and now and I wish that you knew Lay all you want. Me Lay on me I'll be your. You spelled your purse on too badly Searching for something for your hand since then you never come clean I mean you wish you only could. Lay all you want me Lay all you want on me I'll be a. I can get it I can get it I can get it I can get it I can get I can't get it I can't get it I can't get it I can't get it I can get. I can't get out. And I find that even time well spent get spent if you need it to. We do, We do. Lay all you want me Lay all you want on me Lay all you want on me I'll be you. Lay all you. Me I'll be you. I'm not really sure how it works for other bands or other artists, but for us, there's something that has to happen for us to be successful. Successful. And that's that we have to stop aiming for success and actually love what we do. And we did that at the beginning and, you know, we sold a lot of Meet Virginia albums and then Drops of Jupiter albums, and then we really were more focused on success than joy. And that may work for other people, but it didn't work for us at all. We weren't really enjoying being together as much as we were, you know, satisfied by being on the radio or seeing people at shows or whatever. But we got less radio and less people at shows because, you know, if we don't like it, how do other people like it? And we really had to refocus all of that. And we did. You know, we just had to make an adjustment in our attitude to this career, but it really doesn't affect us as far as how we write and what we do. You know, the good thing is our lives show has always been really important to us and that's kind of where the buck stops. Almost like the radio stations and program directors and record companies used to force feed the public. Like, you're going to like this. We're going to put a lot of money behind this. But now it's like the public, we get to hear their opinions because of the itunes, downloads, and you can see what people want to hear. And like, small bands are blowing up and just like YouTube artists are blowing up. So it's like the pumpkin public can decide now and that's the way it should be. But we still look at making records as like a body of work, you know, not like let's have one hit song and then a bunch of crap on there, you know, like, we still look at, you know, we come from the album era and we still like
A Chris: to sit down and put a record
B Neil: on and listen to it from front to finish.
A Chris: Right then, shall we do some facts?
B Neil: Facts. Facts. Yeah. Yeah. Right, I'm gonna get. I'll get. I'll get my list of facts. Artist train album drops of Jupiter.
A Chris: It's a good name.
B Neil: Yeah. I never really got it.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Do you know what I mean?
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Like, I. I don't. It's a cool name. Like, I don't get. I don't get it. The. The song is interesting, obviously, the songs that his mum had died and he was kind of, kind of imagining her in her journey through the cosmos, which kind of makes a bit of sense.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: When you think of it like that. But I only knew it was about his mum when we started reading.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Before.
B Neil: Yeah. So, like, before that it was just, I don't know, a bit weird, I think, but makes sense, wouldn't you know.
A Chris: Well, I thought it was about a girl.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Because I've sang this quite. I've sang this song quite a lot. I played it quite a lot, you know, at gigs and stuff too. Yeah, I actually really enjoy singing it. Yeah, it's a really, really good song to sing. And. And yeah, I've always had it in my mind when I'm singing that it's about a girl that he loves.
B Neil: Not someone's dead mom, not. Yeah, yeah, they're good label. Columbia Records, who picked them up. They were turned down by loads of other record labels. They were not like, considered attractive enough for whatever reason, I think because they didn't have a banger, you know, when they didn't.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Have. They were a pop band, which. Without pop songs.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Which I think is interesting. 11 tracks on the album in the standard edition. It was the 20th anniversary I was talking about. So this was 2001. 2021 was the SACD anniversary edition. And then they added six bonus tracks.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: So they added a bunch of other stuff there. It's one of. It's. It holds the. Is it. And I'm remembering it's not in my notes, but I think I'm right by saying this. This holds the record of one of the slowest journeys to number one, really, on the. On the album chart. So it was. It took longer than. Yeah, took almost a year. And then. And then finally, you know. Absolutely, absolutely landed. It sold 10 million copies, 3 million in the US dress alone. But it was a slow burner. Three singles, drops of Jupiter, Tell me something More and She's on Fire. She's on Fire was my favorite.
A Chris: What's it. You know that one?
B Neil: I do, yeah. I thought that was Good.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: The 20th anniversary edition had the six extra tracks on there. So it had Sweet Rain, which was. Which was brand new. Then it's got It's Love, this is not your life. Ramble on, which is a Lead Zeppelin cover.
A Chris: Oh, right, right.
B Neil: Sharks. And then they did.
A Chris: There's a story about. About that.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: The Led Zeppelin thing. Didn't they. Weren't they a Led Zeppelin tribute band or covers band or something?
B Neil: That's how they started.
A Chris: That's how they started. Right, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And then drops a Jupiter Live, which. Which is pretty cool, interestingly as well. So the planned second single from the album was Something More.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And they'd already shot a music video for it.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And it features Pat climbing up the exterior of a high rise building.
A Chris: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And then on 11th of September 2001 was when the Twin Towers were attacked. And then. And then it. There's like just a little note which just says that video became unusable.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: So, yeah, they, they, they just, they just couldn't do it. So they just scrapped it and then moved on to she's on Fire. But there was a big gap between the, the releases, which. Yeah, I think it's, it's easy to forget, isn't it? The impact that has. We talked about Little Angels, they, Their album. What did they have? The Gulf War. I think for them, they had an album called an album which was going to get released to Spitfire. It's going to be called Spitfire. And a record label would just.
A Chris: Just killed him. Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: It's funny, isn't it?
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: But then it got, you know, released two years later and no one cares.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You see, I've wrote one of the greatest songs in the world called the Straight of Hormuz and, you know, Just can't release it now.
B Neil: Oh, my God, this is really funny. You just imagine that. Yeah. It's such a beautiful place to write a song as well. I love that. We're gonna go from a small tangent
A Chris: just to say nothing bad's happened in the Straight of Hormuz yet, by the way. So, like, if you listen to this and it's like 2027 or something, and something awful has happened in that straight.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: That. We don't know about that yet.
B Neil: Yeah, I, I watched a, an explainer, a YouTube. It was, it was a news clip and it was. It was a guy explaining, like the, the, The Middle east problem was it's always explaining everything and then, and then, and then explains that the Straight of Hormuz isn't even straight. And it killed me. Absolutely. You know, sometimes it looks something's flawed.
A Chris: She nailed it.
B Neil: Yeah. That was just like banging as if it was written. That was for me, that was like. Joe. I mean, I'm a bit of a. I'd love to be a comedy writer. And I'd be. Yeah.
A Chris: I mean, I think.
B Neil: Why didn't I think of that? Such a so good open straight. It's beautifully written, but I don't think it was written. I think he just did it off the cop. Right. Let me go through to the bottom bit where here. So I'm going to give you things you might not know about Drops of Jupiter, although we've probably talked about a bunch of them. So Monahan wrote the entire Drops of Jupiter lyrics in about 15 minutes after waking from a Dream. So we've got an interview clip of that, but he said it's one of the fastest times he's ever written a song.
A Chris: Yeah. And they fall out. They do that. That's a. That is a thing they thought. They. If you. Sometimes it happens like that, they just fall out of you. You've got no choice in the matter. Or that's what it feels like.
B Neil: We've talked about this before, but this is one thing that I hope AI does is empowers people that are perhaps not musical or. Or are learning the guitar or an instrument, but like you, I mean, and enables them to get that thing that's inside of them and out.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And I hope it's used less for stealing other people's work and more for empowering people who've got drops of Jupiter in their brain but perhaps don't have a piano.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Anyway, number two, Soy latte and deep fried chicken, which are in the. The lyrics in the bridge.
A Chris: He.
B Neil: Pat was asked to change them. The record label said they were not masculine enough for a rock. Rock song.
A Chris: No.
B Neil: And we've already established this was a album for girls. Maybe that's why.
A Chris: That's it.
B Neil: No, that's what it is. So, yeah, it's soy latte and deep fried chicken. That's why it's a girl.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: So don't blame us. Blame the record label or. But I don't know. Interesting.
A Chris: This is. It wasn't. Changed him anyway.
B Neil: So I think it's really cool.
A Chris: I think it's really cool that he changed them.
B Neil: What I love about it was he
A Chris: probably said, yeah, yeah, right, I will. Yeah.
B Neil: I love the interview clip where he goes, yeah, changed them and then just didn't bother. And I just think that is the coolest thing ever. Chuck Leavel, who played piano on.
A Chris: No, that's the Rolling Stones, man.
B Neil: Yes, he was the Rolling Stone. He was the touring pianist because that's how important they are. They have like a multi. You, you, you. You have a couple of different pianists. Yeah, you know, you don't want to wear them out. So you have a touring pianist and then you have a Saturday pianist. Saturday pianist and a Sunday pianist. It was also in the Oldman Brothers Band family as well. I think that's quite cool. Anyway, the original video for Something More, which was delayed. We talked about this. It was delayed because of September 11, the attack on the Twin Towers. Drops of Jupiter holds a notable record on the Billboard Adult Contemporary charts. It climbed to the top 10 during its 49th week on the rank ranking, marking the longest climb to the top 10 by any act on the chart.
A Chris: That's what you're very interested.
B Neil: It then spent a total of 54 weeks on the Adult Contemporary tally, An extraordinary sustained presence for a rock song.
A Chris: See, this is the thing, isn't it? Is that what's better? Like smashing it in at number one and then going, yeah, and then disappearing straight away, or like holding your own like that on the chart for so long.
B Neil: It's a funny album for me, this one is, because it's. This is an album that I really. I really like and I think I like it more now than I did. But back then, same. And back then it would have been about Drops of Jupiter. It's not so much anymore. I think the album. This album stands up to me. The. The, like, the deep cuts here stand
A Chris: up more than I. I agree entirely.
B Neil: Some of the others.
A Chris: Yeah. And if you. If you've ever sort of. I suppose I would say that if you've ever kind of dismissed this record or chose. Chosen not to kind of run with it because of the jobs of Jupiter Success. Some people do that, you know, when there's a song's recent. Oh, I'm not. I'm not bothered about that. I don't really like that one. Yeah, but you don't give the other stuff a chance. Give the other stuff a chance because there's. There's some really beautiful music on this
B Neil: record, I think so. It's a really, really cool record. Donnie Lena, who was the Columbia Records president who championed the song, told Monahan before recording was completed that it was going to be a Grammy. Yeah, I was going to win a Grammy for it. And he did. It was nominated for loads of. So it was nominated for Record of the Year, Song of the Year and Best Rock Performance. And they were in the running for five categories and they got one. After the event, Pat said he was really disappointed because he got one. It's really. Yeah, it's funny, he said, like, at the time. He said. I remember at the time feeling really. Looking back, it feels idiotic and really stupid to have had those feelings. Yeah, but you know, and look. Looking back on you, we were just some kids who, you know, played, played music and it was such an amazing thing to be part of it. But at the time, I remember feeling like, pretty annoyed that we didn't win them all.
A Chris: Yeah, but there's a lot.
B Neil: There's like Jay Z and there was some massive. Yeah, this was A time of Megastars.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: The last track on the album is called Mississippi.
A Chris: I'm glad you've said. Yeah, because this is. This is my favorite song.
B Neil: And Mississippi is my favorite tribute to Jeff Buckley, who drowned in the Mississippi River May 97. And he was 30. And train had been listening to Buckley's Grace album during their initial touring cycle for their debut album. His passing really affected them and so they wanted to do a tribute.
A Chris: It's a great. It's such a good song.
B Neil: It's interesting for me because it's got. It's. It's easily the most complicated arrangement of the. Of the album. It's got saxophones on it. Saxophone. Do you say saxophone? Is it saxophone? Saxophone.
A Chris: Saxophone.
B Neil: Saxophone. But anyway, it's got saxophones on there, which is weird on here. But I think that comes from Jeff Buckley. Yeah. That kind of influence on there.
A Chris: So I think they were about talking touring, like quite recently, and I think they had a. I don't know whether it was a different guitarist. Guitarist with them or someone who kind of like came in and just did it, did a sort of cameo at the show or whatever. But there's one where he's playing. I think he's playing a semi acoustic guitar.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Like it might be a Gibson E35 or 355, whatever it is, one of those sort of things. And like the things that he does with his guitar shouldn't be like you shouldn't do it with that guitar, really is absolutely, like just going for it, you know, really going for it. It's amazing. It's absolutely. It's amazing. It's well worth finding, I think.
B Neil: Monahan. I'm not quite sure of the lineup changes, but I know, like this album lineup didn't last very long though, like two years. And everybody. And. And Pat's the only surviving member.
A Chris: Right. Okay, well, that would make sense then. So if there's different people touring with. With the band there now. Yeah. But this particular guitarist, I'm not entirely sure who he is. Dan. It was Dan Baker that sent me in, said, you got to check this guitar player.
B Neil: We know that and we know Dan Baker doesn't exist. That's fine. He will come on the show one day.
A Chris: One day? Yeah, one day.
B Neil: Is he still really busy?
A Chris: Yeah. No. Yeah.
B Neil: Has he?
A Chris: No. And he's really chilled out.
B Neil: It's the truth. Danny's like the most laid back. Laid back person ever. So here about. How about. Dan's not bothered by the straight of hormones.
A Chris: The fact that it's no I ran to him a lot about it, though.
B Neil: That it's not straight.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah. And he goes, oh, yeah, yeah. He literally has to be on with this, actually.
B Neil: I can imagine Dan being really upset about the fact that it's not straight. Do you know they keep saying it's straight and it's not. No, he's probably not.
A Chris: We're going to play Mississippi in a minute. It's so. It's so good.
B Neil: My favorite bit of trivia about this whole album involves Charlie Sheen.
A Chris: Oh, no. I've totally missed this off the blog. I didn't really. I must not have heard this bit.
B Neil: So the album cycle generated a somewhat unusual piece of celebrity trivia. Actor Charlie Sheen told police in December 2009 that his then wife, Brooke Mueller, had objected to the fact that he and his daughter shared an emotional connection to the song Drops of Jupiter. The ensuing argument resulted in Sheen's arrest on Christmas Day. Monahan responded on Twitter with characteristic equinity.
A Chris: Good. Yeah.
B Neil: Choosing to regard the song's role in their relationship as a positive thing. I just think it's mad. I think it's really funny. Anyway, that's good. And then in 2011, train launched a wine range.
A Chris: There's a Drops of Jupiter wine, isn't there?
B Neil: Yeah. So you can buy Drops of Jupiter California Red. Yeah, I. I don't know. Like, at what point?
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: You know what's happened, don't you? Somebody's own. Somebody's bought. Bought a vineyard. Yes, I think I know.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And then. And then you. And then you. Then you. You. Then you. You go from there. Which is interesting. What else did I want to talk about? I wanted to talk a little bit about. I've got to find the right section.
A Chris: Oh.
B Neil: In tv, film and media. So we talked a little bit about this. So respect was. I think Respect is probably my favorite.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: It was in Songs from Dawson Creek Volume 2 before the album came out. So you got like a little bit
A Chris: of a. I think you were right earlier. Yeah.
B Neil: Which is. Which is quite cool. It was in Daredevil season one.
A Chris: That's quite. Is that quite recent?
B Neil: Daredevil the season 2015.
A Chris: Oh, no, not. Not at all then. Right.
B Neil: So 2015. Still recent, isn't it?
A Chris: That was last year.
B Neil: It was in. It was in other people as well. And there was a dude. I found a dude called Phil Pool who sang Drops of Jupiter on the voice in April 2012.
A Chris: Right. Wow.
B Neil: On YouTube.
A Chris: YouTube.
B Neil: He's dead. Good. He was quite good, actually.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And interestingly, the single then recharted because of that. It was so.
A Chris: That's so crazy popular, the Kate Bush thing with the Stranger Things.
B Neil: Kate Bush, yeah. So, yeah. Running up that hill. The voice of God. Anyway, she. Yeah, she. Honestly, the. The Stranger Things are. My kids. Played that over and over again.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: I don't. I don't. I'm never really a big Kate Bush fan.
A Chris: No.
B Neil: But I didn't. I quite liked her, you know, because she's quite.
A Chris: She sort of stood for in that. She's quite cool. Yeah.
B Neil: Bush.
A Chris: Yeah. They really overused it in that season.
B Neil: Yeah, they really like every.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it was like every. Every second there was a little.
B Neil: Boys, of course, all of that.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, Y.
B Neil: And yes, that is. Yeah. I was going to talk about like the. The stuff that was. It was competing against, you know, kind of Linkin Park's Hybrid Theory, Matchbox 20, Dave Matthews Band, Counting Crows. They got compared to Counting Crows all the time.
A Chris: It's a different vibe. It's a. It's a.
B Neil: It's a similar.
A Chris: You sort of see similar sound.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Like they've got songs. Maybe it's that. Yeah, but, yeah, different. Yeah.
B Neil: Songs.
A Chris: Count Crows were a lot darker sound than at this time, I thought.
B Neil: Recovering the Satellites and stuff. Yeah. What was that, 96, was it?
A Chris: Yeah, I think you're right. So. No, it would have been this desert life then. It would have been that era, maybe.
B Neil: Yeah. This.
A Chris: Or even Hard Candy. No, it wasn't.
B Neil: Hard Candy was getting quite popular, I think. Hard, actually. Hard Candy and Train.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, totally. Absolutely.
B Neil: That kind of Big Yellow Taxi and all that stuff. I really love, like, that album, actually. It's quite cool record.
A Chris: I saw them on that tour.
B Neil: Did you?
A Chris: Yeah, they had enough. They were right at the back end, honestly. They were the back end of the tour. I think it was Bristol. Bristol, Brighton.
B Neil: Annoyed, aren't they?
A Chris: But I watched them and you know, I love that. I love them, but they were like, we're really tired and they played brilliantly. They were great. But then I saw them again later. Yeah, Much later in Wolverhampton.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: And they were. They were phenomenal. They were really. They were really on fire that night. Are.
B Neil: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I see. With just humans. Aren't they naked?
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Anyway, I, I, Yeah, but I think like Recovering Satellites, Counting Crows. Counting Crows were like a. I don't know. Yeah, they were a different. For me, I get the comparison tonally, but I think it kind of highlights how tone deaf the reviewers.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: To some degree. I Think.
A Chris: Or they're just going for it easy. They go for easy picks, like. Oh, that's a bit like that, you know.
B Neil: Yeah. Everyone's gonna be everyone. All the albums around that time were being compared against Nirvana, weren't they? Or.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Or Pearl Jam or whatever.
A Chris: I. Lazy, lazy journalism.
B Neil: The other thing, the last. It's not really facts, but I want to talk about it anyway, is the critics. Pandit, which is ludicrous. Did not like it. Like, got like 2 out of 10 and stuff. And everyone said they're a bit crappy, you know, like. Like a Counting Crows pub band, you know. I mean, they just did not. Not. Did not get it at all.
A Chris: Even with. Even with that track. Even. Well, a lot of the tracks on there.
B Neil: It's interesting, isn't it?
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: I think. I think it's interesting. Anyway. Obviously went on to sell, you know.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: 20 million copies.
A Chris: I wonder if they do that, you know, when. If they. The critics do that. They pan something and then suddenly, like, the people have got a different idea about it. I wonder if they sort of rescind it, being. Oh, maybe I got the wrong. No, they don't do, though.
B Neil: No, I don't think so. It's. It's funny to me. I. I used to do reviewing and stuff. I mean, ultimately, most reviewers do you get hold of music early. Yeah, that's beyond. That's what they're doing it for, really. I know some. Some people do it just to be like a face or like a name in that and the thing. But it's funny, I got to a point with it. I did it for about 10 years and I got to a point where I just was. I don't like doing this, Joe. To me, I would like. I remember I got sent a Slash album and I listened to it and I just thought, I. I don't. I don't like it. I don't. It wasn't. I didn't like it, but I just thought. I don't. I can't find anything to say about this. And I'm sure Slash was. It was just to the point that they were getting back. Guns and Roses were getting back together.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: And it felt to me like it had been, like, rushed out of the door a little. And I just kind of thought he'd gone, you know, like, clearly he knew what was happening with Guns and Roses. So he's like, I need to get this out of the way and done now and then. Like, obviously the. The gin off is going to.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Be Be massive.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And. And I got it. And I just thought. I don't, like. I'm not going to say something bad about it. The PR company really wanted us to do something.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And I don't really know what to do. And I just. I just. I. We did something. Eventually. We put something out. But I just got this point where I just thought. I don't like. Like being asked, being forced to say and grade. You know, we were always put under pressure to, like, you've got to give it a grade out. You've got to give it a grade. You got to get, like, how good is it? And it was weird. I. I just got to this point where I just thought, I don't like. I don't like grading this stuff. I don't like when we've established my inability to make a decision for tattoos and like, you know, my. I can't. I can't choose, like, some of my favorite bands. I can't choose my favorite album from them. You know, they're Goo Goo Dolls. Right now, I'd probably pick a boy named Goo, but I'll probably pick superstar Carwish in the morning. Right. I'm not. I'm not good to. You know, I find that really difficult. So I find the whole reviewing thing really hard work. It was. That just seemed a. A bonkers thing. So. So looking back and seeing something like this, I don't know, you kind of just feel. I. I think. I think these guys just sat.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Like you. The reviewers have got their own little niche that they look after, like the rock reviewers and the pop reviewers. And I think Train sat in the middle. I think like a pop reviewer saw them as being a bit too rocky and the rock review saw them as being a bit too poppy.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And just did not give them Goo Goo Dolls sat in a similar state as well. They didn't. They just were not. Yeah. For whatever reason, you know, I mean, they didn't.
A Chris: People were connecting the dots there, but
B Neil: the people did, you know, so the people got it, but the reviewers missed it. I think it skated over their heads a little bit. Anyway, that's it for fact and other stuff.
A Chris: Right. So. Well, let's do Mrs. Mississippi then. And then we shall talk about Spell Mississippi. M I, double S, I, double P, double I.
B Neil: That'll do.
A Chris: M I, double S, I, double S, I, double P, I. Yeah, I think that's it.
B Neil: Yeah. I think you nailed it.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Well, smart. Of all the. All the rubbish you learn at school, that's there you go. Nailed that.
A Chris: Yeah. Sorted. Yeah.
B Neil: Yeah. Wish there was an exam on that.
A Chris: Right, Sean. And then we'll talk about. About what we going to do next week, which we already discussed. So it went very long.
B Neil: She don't flow to me. Spends a lot on buying but she don't. She's the one that makes my dream. They call them Mississippi. She don't flow to me. Makes the morning sun. When she puts her eyes on. Each and anyone. She. He's the one that makes me fall, Man. Sh. Sam. She's the one that makes me fall, Man Shines through reality. She's the one that makes my dream. They call them Mississippi. But she don't flow to me. They call them Mississippi. She don't flow. Sam.
A Chris: Stylish fade out at the end of the record. You don't get many of these in the world anymore. Fade out. I. I actually like a good fade out.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: A good long one. You know when.
B Neil: Long ones I like. I like squealy guitars, solos.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Fade outs, tone feedback.
A Chris: You don't get. The thing is. Right.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: Because she got not. Not amps now. People are using pedals in that.
B Neil: Yeah.
A Chris: It's really hard to get tone feedback and the world is a worst place because of it.
B Neil: One of my favorite things was seeing Slow Player on their final tour and they. There's a few bits that they do where they'll really hang on that and like Kerry King would just go and like kind of hang on this tone and just slam the guitar into the. Into the wall of, you know, AC DC esque speakers.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And it was just. I remember, like just the hairs on the back of your neck, just like. It doesn't happen these days. Kids don't. Kids don't do that.
A Chris: No. No. That was when we watched Spirit Box on the main stage at Download and there wasn't really anything on the stage and I don't quite know how I felt about that.
B Neil: No.
A Chris: There. It was good, but it was very minimalist, tidy. It was really tidy. Yeah. But I don't. I don't know if I like my rock and roll like that.
B Neil: You wouldn't. Yeah. You imagine like AC DC going, can we have a tidy stage, please? More cabs.
A Chris: More.
B Neil: More. I'd love to cover more AC dc.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I'd really like it. Acdc.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Don't you like it? Everyone likes acd. Yeah.
A Chris: Yeah. That's good.
B Neil: Makes you feel happy. There's a spring. It's spring, isn't it?
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Like it's gonna be. It's Gonna be spring soon. And I always, like in the car. I've got a long journey to do in about a week and I shall definitely be playing some acd. I'm not going to ACDC on cd.
A Chris: No.
B Neil: I shall have to go into some charity shops.
A Chris: Are we going in the car? Car.
B Neil: Yeah. But that's how you. That's how you get your music. That's how I get music these days.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I go into when. When we go shopping. Yeah. To buy important things. I like to go. And what I do is I find things around the house that I can take to the charity shop. Yeah. What I'm actually doing is browsing for CDs. There you go.
A Chris: Nailed it. Mate, that's. You've hacked it. That's a life hack.
B Neil: Yeah, I think so.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Yeah, that's the way forward.
A Chris: Right. Ugly Kid Joe, next week, what's the album called?
B Neil: America's Least Wanted.
A Chris: Yeah, I'm just.
B Neil: I'm just looking up on the. On the. On the Wikipedia while we're. While we're talking.
A Chris: I thought we're having a quick podcast tonight, were we? No, no, we're over 80 minutes.
B Neil: Well, that's shocking. I just. I can't imagine. Yeah, I cannot imagine that we. We dragged this out for an hour and a half like we do every bloody week. But, yeah. America's Least Wanted. September 8, 1992. 2. Was it interesting?
A Chris: Is this got. I hate everything about you on it. Is this that one?
B Neil: Everything about you. Madman Neighbor. So damn cool. Cats in the Cradle.
A Chris: I love that one.
B Neil: Busy Be Goddamn Devil. This is.
A Chris: That's a cover, isn't it?
B Neil: Yeah. Cast in the Cable. This is one of the best albums that came out of the 90s. Yeah, I know. Honestly, they got lumped in with like being a joke band or whatever because they, you know, they were a good laugh and they talked about. Yeah, the. Some of the guitar playing on this record is. Production is epic. It rips your face off. It's a proper. Yeah, this. If you've not listened to it for a long time, this is a good one. Yeah, before they did as Ugly as they Want To Be before this, which. That's the one that had everything about you.
A Chris: You.
B Neil: It had Madman and bunch of other stuff on there, but this is the one for me. They did Minister Sobriety in 95, which came afterwards. But. Yeah, but this. This, for me, this one is just. Yeah, it's lovely. Really. It's. It's. Everything about this record is. Is just super cool properly. Of the 90s.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: I think so. But this is a good. This is one where you. I. This is another one where I turn it up. It's like an ACDC record. I. I can't. I'll start off sensibly.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then I'll be two tracks in and it'll be, you know, up to 11.
A Chris: Have you got it in the car ready for. Ready for your drive?
B Neil: I don't. Oh, I should get it, shouldn't I? I don't. I don't have this to get this.
A Chris: I don't know where you get it from.
B Neil: You know, charity shops, everything from. I get. What I do is I go looking around charity shops.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then if I can't. The problem with the charity shop stuff is they're like. Like, they want top dollar for your CDs, and then they're like. Often they're rubbish. I mean, you have a look. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. They're a bit nerf, but. Yeah, that's. That's what I like. I like going and getting the original ones because they smell nice.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then. And then if you're really struggling, discogs. And then if you really struggle, you can get ebay. Yeah. Well, most have been reissued, so you can go onto the Amazon.
A Chris: Okay. Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: And you can. You can buy them. But ten quid?
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Oh, for a CD. Do you know what I mean?
A Chris: 4.99. It should be.
B Neil: I think so.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Four quid. Five quid.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And like, are you. You like. I mean, I think when I'm in my charity shop and I'm looking around and I see a CD and it's not brilliant, but they want, like, seven quid or something for it. Some, I think. Well. But I feel like I'm doing a good thing.
A Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
B Neil: And like, I don't, like. I mean, I don't spend a great deal of money. You know what I mean? I. I like. I don't. I don't buy a lot of stuff, so I kind of think, you know, it feels nice to give it to a bit charity. I feel less positive when I've had to buy it from Amazon. And although I think maybe we could launch Jeff Bezos into space and leave him then. That'd be really cool.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think I'd like, if it funds that.
B Neil: You just launch it. Like. Like launch him into. Like launch him into space with the camera.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: And then all he can have is what he can buy off Amazon. And then, like, once every two weeks. Yeah. I mean, the cardboard parcels arrive.
A Chris: Yeah, yeah.
B Neil: Spaceship and that's all he has. Yeah, that'd be brilliant. Yeah, I'd watch that. Which is watch a man slowly go crazy on his own shopping on his own app. I think he's an alien.
A Chris: Yeah, I think they all are.
B Neil: Do you think he's the lizard ones? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Him and Zuckerberg. Yeah, they're definitely aliens.
A Chris: Yeah.
B Neil: Yeah. Proper made the pyramids. Yeah, in a lunch break, probably. Should we go before we get in trouble?
A Chris: Let's go.
B Neil: See ya.
A Chris: Bye.